Nornagest comments on On Terminal Goals and Virtue Ethics - Less Wrong

67 Post author: Swimmer963 18 June 2014 04:00AM

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Comment author: Nornagest 16 June 2014 10:16:48PM *  6 points [-]

Those aren't bad. I'd been rather fond of the World of Darkness 2E version (by the same company), which medievalists, recovering Catholics, and history-of-philosophy geeks might recognize as the seven Christian virtues altered slightly to be less religion-bound; but these look better-defined and with less overlap.

There do some to be some lacunae, though. I don't think justice fits well under compassion, nor conscientiousness under conviction (I'd put that under temperance); and nothing quite seems to cover the traditional virtue of prudence (foresight; practical judgment; second thoughts).

I'll have to think about less traditional ones.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 18 June 2014 03:07:29AM 5 points [-]

I don't think justice fits well under compassion

Thinking about this people making this mistake explains a lot of bad thinking these days. In particular, "social justice" looks a lot like what you get by trying to shoehorn justice under compassion.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 17 June 2014 01:03:55AM 3 points [-]

Well, with your modifications these map pretty clearly to six of the seven Christian virtues, the missing one being Hope.

Comment author: Nornagest 17 June 2014 01:22:49AM *  3 points [-]

An earlier version of my comment went into more depth on the seven Christian virtues. I rejected it because I didn't feel the mapping was all that good.

Courage/valor is traditionally identified with the classical virtue of fortitude, but I feel the emphasis there is actually quite different; fortitude is about acceptance of pain in the service of some greater goal, while Ialdabaoth's valor is more about facing up to anxiety/doubt/possible future pain. In particular, I don't think Openness maps very well at all to fortitude.

Likewise, the theological virtue of faith maps pretty well to conviction if you stop at that word, but not once you put the emphasis on resolve/grit/heroic effort.

Prudence could probably be inserted unmodified (though I think it could be named more clearly). Justice is a tricky one; I'm not sure what I'd do with it.