Username comments on [moderator action] Eugine_Nier is now banned for mass downvote harassment - Less Wrong

107 Post author: Kaj_Sotala 03 July 2014 12:04PM

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Comment author: buybuydandavis 04 July 2014 03:24:14AM *  5 points [-]

Eugine admitted his guilt,

Did he admit his guilt, or his actions? From the outside, it sounds like the latter.

Although the wording does not explicitly mention downvoting, harassment by downvoting is still harassment.

Begging the question that mass downvoting amounts to harassment. Downvoting is downvoting. Votes can be positive or negative. Would he be similarly banned if he had karma bombed positive votes and it made people feel all warm and fuzzy?

Needless to say, it is not the place of individual users to unilaterally decide that someone else should be "weeded" out of the community.

I assumed it was everyone's place to decide how to cast their votes. Think globally, act locally, yada yada. Ironically, he was acting in accordance with the widely held view that some people needed to be silenced to improve the atmosphere.

Several users have indicated that they have experienced considerable emotional anguish from the harassment

People told you he "made" them feel bad. I guess "Feel Bad" negative karma votes are ok. And get a lot of action from those with power too.

The fact that Eugine remained quiet about his guilt

He remained silent about how he voted, in line with the privacy configuration for votes, which has now been explicitly violated by those with the power entrusted to them. Bad precedent.

is indicative of him realizing that he was breaking prevailing social norms.

Really? Breaking social norms is now verboten in our community of polyamorous transhumans?

Seems to me he was simply acting in accordance with one prevailing norm (one that I disagree with), by violating another (that I agree with).

Eugine's actions have worsened the atmosphere of this site

Other people were part of the causal chain of a "worsened atmosphere". Assigning him as "the cause" is a judgment. Me, I'm not enthusiastic with the prevailing culture of "I'm upset, therefore you're wrong."

I asked the community for guidance on dealing with the issue.

And the pitchforks came out. Three years, 9000+ karma. Now, banned for life. The mob is fickle.

Funny thing is, I was equally unimpressed with all the signal to noise complaints. I've turned off filtering based on karma. I'd rather filter based on vote count than vote sum.

I find an atmosphere of bad feelings and social shunning rather tiresome all the way around. Buck up and don't shun - that's my preferred atmosphere, and that goes for Eugine and the concerns about signal to noise as much as those who would ban him now for hurt feelings.

All indications are his negative votes were for people being MoreWrong, in his opinion. Having people think you're MoreWrong is unpleasant. I don't think the ideal answer is to shut up those who share that opinion with you.

Comment author: Username 05 July 2014 02:23:58AM 0 points [-]

Perhaps differences between eugine's and kaj's political views caused a harsher punishment.

Comment author: buybuydandavis 05 July 2014 06:09:45AM *  4 points [-]

Kaj's political views likely played a part in how he saw this, as would anyone's, but I don't get the sense of "I'm gonna stick it to the other team" from Kaj here.

EDIT: BUT, I think political views likely played a part in the more general reaction, and thereby the resulting punishment.

EDIT2: see http://lesswrong.com/lw/kfq/moderator_action_eugine_nier_is_now_banned_for/b2gp

Personally, I'm glad Eugine is gone, because even without the downvoting he was an asshole. And having anti-feminist or biorealist assholes running around is a great way to drive off women and minorities.

Comment author: [deleted] 06 July 2014 12:35:12PM 0 points [-]

differences between eugine's and kaj's political views

That's something that irked me as well: I would have preferred the ban to be performed by somebody other than a self-identified feminist.

OTOH, I have seen no evidence that Kaj's political views had anything to do with his decision (I just have a sizeable prior for it because he's human), and I can't even recall him ever talking about politics on LW off the top of my head (I only know about his political views from his comments on Slate Star Codex, and the idea of holding people accountable for things they've said in a different venue, well..., it reminds me of something.)

Comment author: ChristianKl 06 July 2014 12:54:07PM 4 points [-]

That's something that irked me as well: I would have preferred the ban to be performed by somebody other than a self-identified feminist.

Then why didn't you speak up when Kaj asked the community how to deal with the issue?

Comment author: [deleted] 06 July 2014 01:34:35PM 2 points [-]

I wasn't watching the issue that closely back then.