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douglas comments on Fake Morality - Less Wrong
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gutzperson-- I read the article. I am not surprised that there are self-interested parties that are making more of what Flew has said than what he has actully said. (A sad reality when passions are so thourghly engaged.) It seems to me that his basic point, there must be an underlying intelligence to this universe, was shared by Newton, Planck, and Einstein. It appears a belief in God does not hinder one from understanding the universe better than anyone that came before. That is not an arguement for the existence of God though, is it?
Einstein was a pantheist. He had no belief along the lines of a personal God meddling with the universe.
Quote: "I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."
Also relevant: "A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death."
Einstein belongs solidly in the ranks of the freethinkers and not of the religious.
douglas said that Einstein believed in an underlying intelligence to this universe, not that he believed in a personal God.
In your opinion, is belief in an underlying intelligence to this universe not belief in God?
douglas is clearly mistaken on this point as the quotes Andy produces illustrates - pantheism does not posit an "underlying intelligence to this universe", it is as Dawkins describes it "sexed-up atheism".
Andy selected a few quotes that show Einstein did not believe in a personal God. Einstein may have been a pantheist, but only to the extent that pantheists can believe in an "underlying intelligence to this universe" -- because from what I can reconstruct from Einstein's quotes, he did believe in something like that.
For example, this quote from an atheist site:
Also,
Theist sites claim that Einstein believed in God, and atheist sites claim that he didn't, and I read the same quotes in both places. Belief in a non-personal God doesn't seem to have its place, and doesn't seem to be well-understood.
Hmm, interesting, thanks! I have to conclude that Einstein wasn't thinking very clearly about the whole thing...