CCC comments on The Truth and Instrumental Rationality - Less Wrong

11 Post author: the-citizen 01 November 2014 11:05AM

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Comment author: alex_zag_al 01 November 2014 09:01:10PM *  5 points [-]

I like this post, I like the example, I like the point that science is newer than debate and so we're probably more naturally inclined to debate. I don't like the apparently baseless storytelling.

In the jungle of our evolutionary childhood, humanity formed groups to survive. In these groups there was a hierachy of importance, status and power. Predators, starvation, rival groups and disease all took the weak on a regular basis, but the groups afforded a partial protection. However, a violent or unpleasant death still remained a constant threat. It was of particular threat to the lowest and weakest members of the group. Sometimes these individuals were weak because they were physically weak. However, over time groups that allowed and rewarded things other than physical strength became more successful. In these groups, discussion played a much greater role in power and status. The truely strong individuals, the winners in this new arena were one's that could direct converstation in their favour - conversations about who will do what, about who got what, and about who would be punished for what. Debates were fought with words, but they could end in death all the same.

I don't know much about the environment of evolutionary adaptation, but it sounds like you don't either. Jungle? Didn't we live on the savannah? And forming groups for survival, it seems just as plausible that we formed groups for availability of mates.

If you don't know what the EEA was like, why use it as an example? All you really know is about the modern world. I think reasoning about the modern world makes your point quite well in fact. There are still plenty of people living and dying dependent on their persuasive ability. For example, Adolf Hitler lived while Ernst Rohm died. And we can guess that it's been like this since the beginning of humanity and that this has bred us to have certain behaviors.

I think this reasoning is a lot more reliable, in fact, than imagining what the EEA was like without any education in the subject.

Maybe I'm being pedantic--the middle of the post is structured as a story, a chronology. It definitely reads nicely that way.

Comment author: CCC 03 November 2014 10:52:44AM 0 points [-]

Jungle? Didn't we live on the savannah?

I thought it was near the ocean...