CellBioGuy comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, February 2015, chapter 112 - Less Wrong

4 Post author: Gondolinian 25 February 2015 09:00PM

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Comment author: CellBioGuy 26 February 2015 12:07:41AM 2 points [-]

Can someone with a horcrux network and the ability to create new bodies create new horcruxes without killing pre-existing people?

Comment author: Jost 26 February 2015 12:44:12AM 5 points [-]

Transform a grain of sand into a human being, make transformation permanent with Philosopher’s Stone, bring them to life with a defibrillator (which should be sufficient to “create” a muggle, if I understand chapter 111 correctly), kill them to create a horcrux. Sure, from what we know, that should work.

The ethics of creating living humans in order to kill them seconds late are … well, debatable, to put it mildly.

Comment author: Velorien 26 February 2015 12:56:41AM 5 points [-]

Voldemort refers to sacrificing one person's "life and magic" to preserve another's when describing the horcrux procedure in 108. This suggests that a muggle would not work as a sacrifice.

Comment author: Nornagest 26 February 2015 12:59:13AM *  3 points [-]

Don't think that'd work. Horcruces, or at least the 1.0 kind, seem to be related to ghosts: Quirrell mentions redirecting a 'death-pulse' to create the caster's ghost instead of the victim's. We don't have a clear idea of how that works, but since Muggles don't leave ghosts, I think it's reasonable to assume that whatever the spell's doing, it needs a magical victim to do it.

We see Voldemort making a Horcrux out of a Muggle in canon, but I don't think we've seen it here.

Comment author: Jost 26 February 2015 01:23:59AM 2 points [-]

In canon he used the murder of his muggle father to make the Gaunt ring (which is inset with the Resurrection Stone) a horcrux, the murder of a muggel tramp to make Slytherin’s locket into a horcrux, and the murder of an Albanian peasant to make Ravenclaw’s diadem a horcrux.

But you’re right, this makes it seem unlikely that a Muggle victim would work. (Damn, these small differences between canon and HPMoR can really confuse me …)

On the other hand, it seems possible to use up a part of one’s magic/life force to create a witch or wizard (cf. Hermione), which could then be killed to create a horcrux. So while these horcruxes aren’t free to make, at least they are not a zero-sum game, either.

Comment author: LauralH 27 February 2015 01:56:12AM *  1 point [-]

From the description of HPMOR's horcrux spell, it won't work unless a witch/wizard is killed.

Edit: didn't see Nornagest's post.

Comment author: CellBioGuy 26 February 2015 02:14:23AM *  1 point [-]

I was thinking more along the lines of:

1 - Possess accomplice

2 - Create your body

3 - Inhabit your body

4 - Have your body killed, creating horcrux that binds to the rest of the network

5 - Repeat

6 - Profit

EDIT: I have realized one potential folly (or alternately, brilliance) of such a plan. It might mean that anyone could create their own horcrux from their own death.

Or it might mean a few people would need to die to establish the initial network but then everyone with a network could create networks for others.

Comment author: imuli 26 February 2015 05:46:32AM *  1 point [-]

Adapting the Horcrux (2.0 in HPMoR) spell to make Amulets of Life Saving was the very first thing I thought of when considering ethical immortality in HPverse.

Comment author: DanArmak 26 February 2015 09:38:46AM *  0 points [-]

If the created human is never conscious, but always asleep, I don't see any ethical problems. Creating a sleeping body doesn't really count as creating a sentient human.

Comment author: TobyBartels 26 February 2015 09:19:24PM 0 points [-]

It just depends whether their dreams are good or bad.