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Lumifer comments on Can we talk about mental illness? - Less Wrong
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Mayoclinic defines mental illness as such: "Mental illness refers to a wide range of mental health conditions — disorders that affect your mood, thinking and behavior. Examples of mental illness include depression, anxiety disorders, schizophrenia, eating disorders and addictive behaviors." This seems to be the standard definition.
The statistic of 1 in 5 that I used seems to pretty much only refer to diagnosed people with specific, named disorders. I don't think it was including "I feel sad sometimes" as a mental illness. And considering it was only used statistics based on diagnostics, it seems pretty clear to me that a LOT of people got left out. Many people can't get help. This also only covered the U.S.A., and statistics could vary widely in other areas of the world and based on methods.
If you like, we can taboo the "mental illness" phrase and instead use something like "badly defined and illogically based thinking patterns." That would cover the schizophrenic fantasy/reality disconnect, anxiety, depression, etc. Then it becomes pretty clear that "badly defined and illogically based thinking patterns" are really common and often not as specific as biases. I don't think anyone would claim mental illness is rare. According to the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, 12.6 people out of 100,000 successfully committed suicide in 2013. That means over 41,000 people died, in one year, in the U.S. alone, not counting the suicides ruled as accidents or disappearances. The AFSP says it's not easy to get a good number for suicide attempts, but they believe based on self-harm caused hospitalizations that it easily exceeds 600,000 people a year. And that's just the people who want to die. Eating disorders are gaining attention as one of the more common kinds. Addictive disorders are so common almost everyone knows one or more people struggling. Depression, the same. There's a trend among students where anxiety and stress are causing serious issues.
Also, there's a difference between commonality and normality. Urine fetishes, for instance, are considered abnormal and uncommon. BDSM would be considered normal but uncommon (though 50 Shades of Grey seems to be making it a more common thing.) The urge to eat is normal and common. Mental illness, I would say, are considered common but abnormal.
Honestly, I can't think of a single definition of mental illness that would say it's uncommon. I may be misinterpreting your meaning, but it kind of seems like you're focusing on semantics when the problem here is that common diseased thinking patterns are killing, sickening, and limiting lives.
Actually, I think the "standard" definition is provided by the current DSM. The Mayo Clinic definition is way too vague and general to be of any use.
Sure, but then you are defining stupid people as mentally ill. Are you willing to do that for everyone with, say, the IQ under 85?
Go back a hundred years, for example. Under the definitions used then, was mental illness common?
"Diseased thinking patterns" is a dangerous concept. In the Soviet Union disliking communism was a diseased thinking pattern and people were actually put into mental hospitals for that. Not long ago being attracted to people of the same sex was considered to be a diseased thinking (and feeling, and behavioral) pattern, to be treated as a mental disorder. If I want to lose weight, is that a diseased thinking pattern and who will judge that? If I feel dissatisfied with life, is that a diseased thinking pattern and what kind of a pill will I be prescribed?
Vague, yes, but I disagree that it's useless. It at least is an extremely basic overview that someone can build on.
Hmm. I wouldn't call stupidity mental illness- low IQ doesn't necessarily mean they're an illogical person. it can mean they're slow, or challenged, etc. A person can be "stupid" and not, say, think the moon is made of cheese. Limitations on your complexity of thought doesn't necessarily mean the thoughts you have are wrong.
No, 100 years ago, a woman getting mad at her husband was a sign of mental illness. Mental illness was considered very common. People were put in asylums for anything from homosexuality to being too smart, or being transhumanist, or atheist.
I can see how the concept is dangerous, but only if misused. Cars are dangerous if misused. We use them daily. The idea isn't to toss pills at anyone unhappy or who happens to have different beliefs, the point is that some patterns are harmful and some people would like help with that. I think deciding for others what is harmful is, itself, harmful- if a person enjoys their hallucinations, and the hallucinations don't cause them to do harm, then honestly, we should leave them alone. If a person likes murder, we shouldn't. If you want to lose weight, you should get nutrition and exercise advice. It becomes a diseased thinking pattern if you think you still need to lose weight when you have a body fat index of 5%, or if you think no one will ever care about you if you weigh above 125. If you feel dissatisfied with life, the question is why. If you have everything going perfectly in your life and you're still constantly sad, that's a sign of a problem, and you should probably see a doctor. You might be prescribed therapy rather than a pill.
I think most people decide for themselves if they like their thinking patterns. I don't like mine. I'm seeking help. A person might be friends with the voices in their heads. A person might be tired of them telling him to kill himself. A transgender person may be miserable with their body-mind disjointedness and want therapy and/or a treatment plan to become what they want to be.