Lumifer comments on Rationality Quotes Thread September 2015 - Less Wrong

3 Post author: elharo 02 September 2015 09:25AM

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Comment author: Lumifer 13 October 2015 02:58:34PM 1 point [-]

Then: Did Jesus exist? Well, kinda.

I don't think manipulating definitions can (or should) give rise to probability claims along the lines of "Jesus 50% existed".

Jesus-the-Son-of-God and Jesus-the-itinerant-preacher are two very different people/concepts. No, they will not blend.

Comment author: gjm 13 October 2015 10:08:42PM 1 point [-]

I wouldn't want to defend the "50% existed" claim too seriously, but note that the discussion here was never really about explicit claims of that kind. It was about whether it's appropriate to consider, e.g., "there is a god who gets involved in biological evolution" intermediate between "there is no god" and "there is a god who created every kind of living thing ex nihilo". I say yes; CCC says no. The affirmative answer doesn't require, e.g., being willing to say that a god who never does anything "50% exists"; only regarding a less-active god as in some sense intermediate between a more-active god and no god.

Comment author: CCC 14 October 2015 09:51:03AM 0 points [-]

You can definitely plot all three points on the same graph - you can even plot them such that the distance from "there is no god" to "there is a god who created every kind of living thing ex nihilo" is greater than the distance from "there is a god who gets involved in biological evolution" to either of the two aforementioned points. That can all be done perfectly sensibly.

My claim is simply that the three points can't be colinear on that graph.

...I hope that makes it a bit clearer.

Comment author: gjm 14 October 2015 10:42:52AM 0 points [-]

It seems to me that you can plot them wherever you want to, so this is really a question of aesthetics more than anything else. Or is there some actual consequence that follows from one or another answer to this question?

Comment author: CCC 15 October 2015 09:49:54AM 0 points [-]

...it would be a bit like plotting 0, 1 and i colinearly. (I assume you're familiar with complex numbers?)

Comment author: gjm 15 October 2015 01:43:14PM 0 points [-]

Yes, very familiar with complex numbers, thanks. But, I repeat, you can plot what you want however you want; the question is whether it's helpful, and that will depend on the application. (Suppose the values taken by your dependent variable are all on the circle of radius 1/sqrt(2) centred at (1+i)/2. Then plotting 0, 1, and i collinearly may make a whole lot of sense, though you might actually want to call them -3pi/4, -pi/4 and pi/4 respectively.)

Comment author: CCC 16 October 2015 10:29:19AM 0 points [-]

(Suppose the values taken by your dependent variable are all on the circle of radius 1/sqrt(2) centred at (1+i)/2. Then plotting 0, 1, and i collinearly may make a whole lot of sense, though you might actually want to call them -3pi/4, -pi/4 and pi/4 respectively.)

I reluctantly concede the point, but firmly maintain that calling them -3pi/4, -pi/4 and pi/4 respectively would make a lot more sense.