Elo comments on The Problem (TM) - Analyse a conversation - Less Wrong

-6 Post author: Elo 26 July 2016 11:03AM

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Comment author: Strangeattractor 26 July 2016 12:47:41PM 0 points [-]

The most alarming part of that conversation for me was "A few weeks ago I punched a housemate in the face ten times, breaking her nose;"

If I was having the conversation, I would ask him more about this, and talk at least a little bit about how he could stop hurting other people.

I'm not sure what you mean by the bottom of the problem. I will say some things that I think are problems. These are speculations. I don't have enough information to be confident in these answers.

1) I think it is a problem that, as far as I could tell, no one intervened and taught him not to be abusive after the punching incident. This is a problem with society.

2) I think it is likely that he has a brain injury from a head injury of some sort and/or from taking drugs such as meth. He mentioned both a head injury and meth. I would say to get treatment for brain injury, but doctors are still pretty clueless about how to treat brain injuries, though there are experimental possibilities.

3) I think it's possible that he's a sociopath, but there's not enough info to figure that out. The combination of not finding pleasure in life, and feeling no remorse, and not thinking about the effects of his actions on other people is suggestive. (Although there can be other reasons for that.)

4) I think there's likely something else wrong with his health. Maybe bipolar, since the bipolar meds are helping a bit, but I'm not convinced that accounts for everything.

5) I would guess that he did not have opportunities in childhood to be self-directed. His sense of not knowing what he enjoys, or what he wants, or how to make a plan, might be from lack of education and training in those areas, not just from physiological problems affecting his judgement.

Comment author: Elo 26 July 2016 01:10:04PM -2 points [-]

Can you describe how you came to these ideas as TheProblem? Your thought process or your procedure for concluding these?

Comment author: Strangeattractor 26 July 2016 06:16:30PM 1 point [-]

First of all, I think the concept of TheProblem is flawed. I don't think there is necessarily just one problem that is "the bottom of the problem" whatever you mean by that.

You presented a conversation, and asked us to read between the lines. So, I did. If I was actually attempting to figure out what was going wrong, if I was going to take action about it, I'd need way more information than this one conversation. I wouldn't describe anything I said as conclusions. My procedure for concluding these is "I didn't conclude them."

What specifically do you want to know about my thought process or procedure? I already put clues in what I've written. For example, some of the reasons I think he may be a sociopath is the combination of not finding pleasure in life, feeling no remorse, and not showing any thought for the effects of his actions on other people in his responses. I already said that. Also, sociopaths are about 4% of the population. It's plausible. Given that, and given some pattern recognition from having come across some people who turned out to be sociopaths, and given what I've read in the several books I've read about them, I would at least keep it as a possibility in mind while dealing with this person. It's also a question "Is this person a sociopath or not?" that affects how you may want to behave going forward and what is likely to work or not.

I can only bring my own knowledge and experiences to this, and there may be stuff I'm missing because I don't have experiences with it, or stuff that is a projection of what I've encountered, and not applicable in this situation.

I don't understand what you are asking me, or what specifically you want to know. I can go into more detail, but it's tough to know which details you are interested in or asking for.