Will_Sawin comments on The Design Space of Minds-In-General - Less Wrong

19 Post author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 25 June 2008 06:37AM

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Comment author: Will_Newsome 08 January 2011 03:39:29AM *  2 points [-]

If you're just giving it a shape to copy then I don't see why that would be more than a hundred bytes or so - trivial compared to the optimizer.

A hundred bytes in what language? I get the intuition, but it really seems to me like paper clips are really complex. There are lots of important qualities of paperclips that make them clippy that seem to me like they'd be very hard to get an AI to understand. You say you're giving it a shape, but that shape is not at all easily defined. And its molecular structure might be important, and its size, and its density, and its ability to hold sheets of paper together... Shape and molecular component aren't fundamental attributes of the universe that an AI would have a native language for. This is why we can't just keep an oracle AI in a box -- it turns out that our intuitive idea of what a box is is really hard to explain to a de novo AI. Paperclips are similar. And if the AI is smart enough to understand human concepts that well, then you should also be able to just type up CEV and give it that instead... CEV is easier to describe than a paperclip in that case, since CEV is already written up. (Edit: I mean a description of CEV is written up, not CEV. We're still working on the latter.)

Comment author: Will_Sawin 10 January 2011 12:18:04AM 2 points [-]

If you can understand human concepts, "paperclip" is sufficient to tell you about paperclips. Google "paperclip," you get hundreds of millions of results.

"Understanding human concepts" may be hard, but understanding arbitrary concrete concepts seems harder than understanding arbitrary abstract concepts that take a long essay to write up and have only been written up by one person and use a number of other abstract concepts in this writeup.

Comment author: JoshuaZ 21 January 2011 02:31:58PM 1 point [-]

but understanding arbitrary concrete concepts seems harder than understanding arbitrary abstract concepts

Do you mean easier here?

Comment author: Will_Sawin 21 January 2011 09:04:05PM 1 point [-]

Yes.