TimS comments on Whither Moral Progress? - Less Wrong

15 Post author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 16 July 2008 05:04AM

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Comment author: ArisKatsaris 11 April 2013 12:37:27PM *  2 points [-]

Morally, we do know such a thing.

This sounds like an is-ought confusion. "Some people would be happier as slaves." is an is-statement -- it's either right or wrong (true or false) as a matter of fact, regardless of morality. "Slavery oughtn't exist" is a moral statement -- it only has a truth value according to a particular ethical/moral set.

I don't know whether "naturally suited for slavery" is supposed to be a "is" or an "ought" statement (descriptive or prescriptive). If it's an is-statement then our moral sense is irrelevant to whether the statement is true or false as a matter of fact.

Comment author: TimS 11 April 2013 01:44:04PM 1 point [-]

"Some people would be happier as slaves." is an is-statement -- it's either right or wrong (true or false) as a matter of fact, regardless of morality.

I agree generally with your point, but this sentence assumes "happier" is an objective quality - which may not be true. if we were to taboo "happier" in that sentence, the new phrasing might include a moral claim. Consider:

"Everyone is happier if jocks can haze nerds without complaint" --> "Jocks by show virtue by hazing nerds, and nerds show virtue by accepting hazing without complaint."

The second sentence contains a number of explicit and implicit moral claims. Those moral claims are also present in the first sentence, just concealed by the applause light word "happy."