Politics Discussion Thread December 2012

OrphanWilde

I skipped October and November owing to election season, but opening back up:

Top-level comments should introduce arguments; responses should be responses to those arguments.
Upvote and downvote based on whether or not you find an argument convincing in the context in which it was raised. This means if it's a good argument against the argument it is responding to, not whether or not there's a good/obvious counterargument to it; if you have a good counterargument, raise it. If it's a convincing argument, and the counterargument is also convincing, upvote both. If both arguments are unconvincing, downvote both.
A single argument per comment would be ideal; as MixedNuts points out here, it's otherwise hard to distinguish between one good and one bad argument, which makes the upvoting/downvoting difficult to evaluate.
In general try to avoid color politics; try to discuss political issues, rather than political parties, wherever possible.

As Multiheaded added, "Personal is Political" stuff like gender relations, etc also may belong here.

I skipped October and November owing to election season, but opening back up:

Top-level comments should introduce arguments; responses should be responses to those arguments.
Upvote and downvote based on whether or not you find an argument convincing in the context in which it was raised. This means if it's a good argument against the argument it is responding to, not whether or not there's a good/obvious counterargument to it; if you have a good counterargument, raise it. If it's a convincing argument, and the counterargument is also convincing, upvote both. If both arguments are unconvincing, downvote both.
A single argument per comment would be ideal; as MixedNuts points out here, it's otherwise hard to distinguish between one good and one bad argument, which makes the upvoting/downvoting difficult to evaluate.
In general try to avoid color politics; try to discuss political issues, rather than political parties, wherever possible.

As Multiheaded added, "Personal is Political" stuff like gender relations, etc also may belong here.

has that connotation for those unfortunate enough to be familiar with his views.

On the contrary I think many more people should be reading Roissy. People here especially. Try out his advice, experiment with it and other variants extensively. If it doesn't work no biggie try something else, but do try it in good faith. I give this advice because this is how I massively improved my own romantic life. Authors like Roissy, Mystery and Athol Kay gave me a good map to understand social and sexual dynamics that mystified me before.

Currently I say the subtitle of his blog is perfectly accurate. There are a whole lot of pretty lies out there, bad advice that is in fact anti-knowledge when it comes to sex and dating. Some of it is well meaning but obsolete, crafted to reality that no longer exists, but some is created with the full knowledge it will harm its carriers. Heartiste demolishes many of them with the sadistic glee they deserve.

I doubt the pretty lies are doing much good because we see they don't condem other things that contribute to the evils they supposedly fight. I mistrust the pretty lies as the incentives working on those who craft them are perverse. I condem the pretty lies because I see friends making stupid decisions based on them that end up wrecking their lives.

I hate the pretty lies because my belief in them was rewarded by stagnation, blindness and pain.

I wouldn't have argued this in such vivid fashion if I wasn't ticked off at how casually you dump boo lights when talking about a guy I'm pretty sure is on net doing something good.

I'd like to know what you think of this (unfortunately long) piece arguing (persuasively IMO) that Mystery/Roissy-style PUA is solving the wrong problem and a memetic hazard.

The right thing for these guys to do would be to deal with these core issues of low self-worth feelings and their inferiority feelings so that they can fix them once and for all. What pickup teaches them to do however is not to fix feelings but instead to switch from their current faulty coping strategy, which is surrender, to another faulty coping strategy of overcompensation. Using

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3Multiheaded14y

[citation needed] [...] [citation needed] [...] Ok, now we're getting closer. I sympathize with you, just as I try to sympathize with everyone who says they've been hurt or fucked over or betrayed. And I would feel wrong it I turned a friend away with some dismissive/inconsiderate talk. However, could you please admit that while your hurtful experience might bring you closer to the situation emotionally, it certainly introduces some amount of bias and one-sidedness to your perception?

4Multiheaded14y

Do you think that people like pjeby give worse advice, then? I don't think so; I think there must be a lot of good, competent PUA teachers out there who discard shock value and over-the-top cynicism for actually helping people. With actually benevolent intentions. Is that so unrealistic?

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Politics Discussion Thread December 2012

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Politics Discussion Thread December 2012

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