Q: What has Rationality Done for You?

atucker

So after reading SarahC's latest post I noticed that she's gotten a lot out of rationality.

More importantly, she got different things out of it than I have.

Off the top of my head, I've learned...

that other people see themselves differently, and should be understood on their terms (mostly from here)
that I can pay attention to what I'm doing, and try to notice patterns to make intervention more effective.
the whole utilitarian structure of having a goal that you take actions to achieve, coupled with the idea of an optimization process. It was really helpful to me to realize that you can do whatever it takes to achieve something, not just what has been suggested.
the importance/usefulness of dissolving the question/how words work (especially great when combined with previous part)
that an event is evidence for something, not just what I think it can support
to pull people in, don't force them. Seriously that one is ridiculously useful. Thanks David Gerard.
that things don't happen unless something makes them happen.
that other people are smart and cool, and often have good advice

On top of becoming a little bit more effective at a lot of things, and with many fewer problems.

(I could post more on the consequences of this, but I'm going for a different point)

Where she got...

a habit of learning new skills
better time-management habits
an awesome community
more initiative
the idea that she can change the world

I've only recently making a habit out of trying new things, and that's been going really well for me. Is there other low hanging fruit that I'm missing?

What cool/important/useful things has rationality gotten you?

So after reading SarahC's latest post I noticed that she's gotten a lot out of rationality.

More importantly, she got different things out of it than I have.

Off the top of my head, I've learned...

that other people see themselves differently, and should be understood on their terms (mostly from here)
that I can pay attention to what I'm doing, and try to notice patterns to make intervention more effective.
the whole utilitarian structure of having a goal that you take actions to achieve, coupled with the idea of an optimization process. It was really helpful to me to realize that you can do whatever it takes to achieve something, not just what has been suggested.
the importance/usefulness of dissolving the question/how words work (especially great when combined with previous part)
that an event is evidence for something, not just what I think it can support
to pull people in, don't force them. Seriously that one is ridiculously useful. Thanks David Gerard.
that things don't happen unless something makes them happen.
that other people are smart and cool, and often have good advice

On top of becoming a little bit more effective at a lot of things, and with many fewer problems.

(I could post more on the consequences of this, but I'm going for a different point)

Where she got...

a habit of learning new skills
better time-management habits
an awesome community
more initiative
the idea that she can change the world

I'm going to be poking at this question from several angles-- I don't think I've got a complete and concise answer.

I think you've got a bad case of God's Eye Point of View-- thinking that the most rational and/or moral way to approach the universe is as though you don't exist.

The thing about GEPOV is that it isn't total nonsense. You can get more truth if you aren't territorial about what you already believe, but since you actually are part of the universe and you are your only point of view, trying to leave yourself out completely is its own flavor of falseness.

As you are finding out, ignoring your needs leads to incapacitation. It's like saying that we mustn't waste valuable hydrocarbons on oil for the car engine. All the hydrocarbons should be used for gasoline! This eventually stops working. It's important to satisfy needs which are of different kinds and operate on different time scales.

You may be thinking that, since fun isn't easily measurable externally, the need for it isn't real.

I think you're up against something which isn't about rationality exactly-- it's what I call the emotional immune system. Depression is partly about not being able to resist (or even being attracted to) ideas which cause damage.

An emotional immune system is about having affection for oneself, and if it's damaged, it needs to be rebuilt, probably a little at a time.

On the intellectual side, would you want all the people you want to help to defer their own pleasure indefinitely?

On the intellectual side, would you want all the people you want to help to defer their own pleasure indefinitely?

No, but I don't know what a solution would look like. Most of the time I am just overwhelmed as it feels like everything I come up with isn't much better than throwing a coin. I just can't figure out the right balance between fun (experiencing; being selfish), moral conduct (being altruistic), utility maximization (being future-oriented) and my gut feelings (instinct; intuition; emotions). For example, if I have a strong urge to just go out ... (read more)

6Eliezer Yudkowsky15y

This sounds very true and important.

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Q: What has Rationality Done for You?

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Q: What has Rationality Done for You?

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