Eight questions for computationalists

dfranke

This post is a followup to "We are not living in a simulation" and intended to help me (and you) better understand the claims of those who took a computationalist position in that thread. The questions below are aimed at you if you think the following statement both a) makes sense, and b) is true:

"Consciousness is really just computation"

I've made it no secret that I think this statement is hogwash, but I've done my best to make these questions as non-leading as possible: you should be able to answer them without having to dismantle them first. Of course, I could be wrong, and "the question is confused" is always a valid answer. So is "I don't know".

As it is used in the sentence "consciousness is really just computation", is computation:
a) Something that an abstract machine does, as in "No oracle Turing machine can compute a decision to its own halting problem"?
b) Something that a concrete machine does, as in "My calculator computed 2+2"?
c) Or, is this distinction nonsensical or irrelevant?
If you answered "a" or "c" to question 1: is there any particular model, or particular class of models, of computation, such as Turing machines, register machines, lambda calculus, etc., that needs to be used in order to explain what makes us conscious? Or, is any Turing-equivalent model equally valid?
If you answered "b" or "c" to question 1: unpack what "the machine computed 2+2" means. What is that saying about the physical state of the machine before, during, and after the computation?
Are you able to make any sense of the concept of "computing red"? If so, what does this mean?
As far as consciousness goes, what matters in a computation: functions, or algorithms? That is, does any computation that give the same outputs for the same inputs feel the same from the inside (this is the "functions" answer), or do the intermediate steps matter (this is the "algorithms" answer)?
Would an axiomatization (as opposed to a complete exposition of the implications of these axioms) of a Theory of Everything that can explain consciousness include definitions of any computational devices, such as "and gate"?
Would an axiomatization of a Theory of Everything that can explain consciousness mention qualia?
Are all computations in some sense conscious, or only certain kinds?

ETA: By the way, I probably won't engage right away with individual commenters on this thread except to answer requests for clarification. In a few days I'll write another post analyzing the points that are brought up.

"Consciousness is really just computation"

As it is used in the sentence "consciousness is really just computation", is computation:
a) Something that an abstract machine does, as in "No oracle Turing machine can compute a decision to its own halting problem"?
b) Something that a concrete machine does, as in "My calculator computed 2+2"?
c) Or, is this distinction nonsensical or irrelevant?
If you answered "a" or "c" to question 1: is there any particular model, or particular class of models, of computation, such as Turing machines, register machines, lambda calculus, etc., that needs to be used in order to explain what makes us conscious? Or, is any Turing-equivalent model equally valid?
If you answered "b" or "c" to question 1: unpack what "the machine computed 2+2" means. What is that saying about the physical state of the machine before, during, and after the computation?
Are you able to make any sense of the concept of "computing red"? If so, what does this mean?
As far as consciousness goes, what matters in a computation: functions, or algorithms? That is, does any computation that give the same outputs for the same inputs feel the same from the inside (this is the "functions" answer), or do the intermediate steps matter (this is the "algorithms" answer)?
Would an axiomatization (as opposed to a complete exposition of the implications of these axioms) of a Theory of Everything that can explain consciousness include definitions of any computational devices, such as "and gate"?
Would an axiomatization of a Theory of Everything that can explain consciousness mention qualia?
Are all computations in some sense conscious, or only certain kinds?

I think the logic behind this argument is actually much, much simpler.

Let us suppose that consciousness is not a type of computation.

Rational argument, and hence rational description IS a type of computation - it can be made into forms that are computable.

Therefore consciousness, if it is not a type of computation, is also not describeable within, or reducible to, rational argument.

I call this type of thing the para-rational - it's not necessarily against rationality to suppose that something exists which isn't rationally describable. What doesn't make sense is to go on to either

a) Attempt to rationally describe it in detail afterwards. or b) Use it as an excuse to avoid thinking rationally about things you CAN think about in a rational way. c) Try and use its properties in a logical argument - all this gives you on the whole is an illogical argument.

So yes, there might be an aspect of consciousness which is beyond the rational, and which is always associated with certain types of existent being. But I would prefer the proposition that this is para-rational - alongside the rational realm, rather than irrational - joined to the rational realm, and making it non-rational after all.

This is a difficult area - as one should necessarily believe para-rational things for para-rational reasons (whatever THAT means). But I can't see how we could rule out other types of 'existence'. However, I can see good reasons not to make it a subject of too much rational discussion - if you can't rationally describe something, don't attempt to....

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Eight questions for computationalists

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Eight questions for computationalists

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