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moridinamael comments on LW systemic bias: US centrism - Less Wrong Discussion

10 Post author: lucidfox 19 July 2011 07:21PM

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Comment author: moridinamael 20 July 2011 08:45:04PM 2 points [-]

Might this be one of those instances where it is globally better for the annoyed party (non-US LWers) to self-modify to accept that everybody uses language from a inside a cultural framework, rather than to request that the majority self-modify to implement not-really-well-specified "universal" norms for English?

As an American engineer I personally think we should all use S.I., but it doesn't do any good to correct people who use English units, unless I take the full effort of convincing them that a consistent unit system is actually more powerful.

Comment author: dbaupp 21 July 2011 01:59:16AM *  1 point [-]

I think the problem is the definitely not the language. From the original post:

  • Presuming the US by default when it is assumed that no country name needs to be given.
  • Expecting reader familiarity with US-specific cultural concepts.
  • A tendency to focus on the US first and foremost when talking about worldwide problems and scenarios.

Expecting people to self-modify to "correct" these is wrong, although I don't think you were suggesting this.

(EDIT: read "wrong" as "unreasonable")

Comment author: lucidfox 21 July 2011 03:30:40PM 0 points [-]

How exactly is it wrong?

Comment author: MixedNuts 21 July 2011 03:38:00PM 2 points [-]

If non-US users modify not to be annoyed by these, then:

Expecting reader familiarity with US-specific cultural concepts.

Readers will keep having to look them up, which they'll still find annoying (unless the self-modification is really big).

A tendency to focus on the US first and foremost when talking about worldwide problems and scenarios.

Suggestions will keep being tailored to the US, leading to a lack of general solutions and custom solutions for other countries.

OTOH, I'm not sure what's wrong with self-modifying to not be annoyed when American users have GetDefaultCountry() return "USA".

Comment author: dbaupp 22 July 2011 12:59:30AM *  1 point [-]

OTOH, I'm not sure what's wrong with self-modifying to not be annoyed when American users have GetDefaultCountry() return "USA".

Nothing, I was thinking about the issue in the wrong way and so I have ameliorated my response accordingly.

Comment author: dbaupp 22 July 2011 12:58:07AM 0 points [-]

Hmmm... on reflection, "wrong" is too strong.

I was thinking that it was that people would have to self-modify to adopt US culture. But, actually thinking about what was being said (thanks, MixedNuts) and what I quoted indicates that it was just self-modifying to become familiar with the concepts.

I still think this is unreasonable, due to, for example, the amount of effort it would take to get decent coverage across all areas of the culture, i.e. it's much easier for US users to make a few annotations ("in the USA", or "governor of Massachusetts", to increase googleability at least).