You're looking at Less Wrong's discussion board. This includes all posts, including those that haven't been promoted to the front page yet. For more information, see About Less Wrong.

wedrifid comments on [Link] Why don't people like markets? - Less Wrong Discussion

9 Post author: GLaDOS 20 June 2012 10:15AM

You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.

Comments (67)

You are viewing a single comment's thread. Show more comments above.

Comment author: wedrifid 21 June 2012 08:39:40AM 9 points [-]

Downvoting this as too political, but:

This is highly relevant to lesswrong - markets are one of the best information aggregation mechanisms available and so understanding why people oppose markets is useful.

Comment author: roystgnr 23 June 2012 05:28:52AM 4 points [-]

Understanding why people oppose markets is very useful, but I've already got many redundant sources of information helping me at that task. Having a forum where discussion isn't infected by "Why do all those wrong-thinking people oppose our truth?" would also be very useful, but there I'm mostly out of luck. I can split my time between the liberal (conservatives and libertarians are so heartless!) and conservative (liberals and libertarians are so evil!) and libertarian (liberals and conservatives are so stupid!) sites instead, but a diverse selection of people talking past each other is much less valuable than a diverse selection talking to each other.

For example, many of those sites that should otherwise know better are incapable of discussing futurist ideas without pigeonholing them politically. For a recent example: "There is a rottenness at the heart of the transhuman project ... mythology of the smugly self-satisfied hypercapitalists who have unintentionally done so much to destroy so many of the moral and interpersonal values of post-Englightenment civilization." If Charlie Freaking Stross can no longer discuss the singularity without digressing into anti-free-market ranting, that suggests it might be particularly valuable to maintain futurist discussion forums in which economic liberals can participate without being treated like ignorant specimens in need of re-education.

Comment author: Bruno_Coelho 24 June 2012 06:47:42PM 0 points [-]

Oppose markets is useful if your are proposing some kind of institutional reform, and the traditional dynamics are not optimal. The author of the article apparently assumes less disagreement only because some groups, like intellectuals, are not sufficient rewarded.

Comment author: Manfred 21 June 2012 11:42:30AM -1 points [-]

Do people "oppose markets" in a way that this classification is useful? If not, a priveleged hypothesis could lead down a blind alley.

Comment author: wedrifid 21 June 2012 11:46:37AM 3 points [-]

Do people "oppose markets" in a way that this classification is useful? If not, a priveleged hypothesis could lead down a blind alley.

If not then it is even less political.

Comment author: Manfred 21 June 2012 12:12:59PM 0 points [-]

Walk me through that.

Comment author: wedrifid 21 June 2012 12:25:08PM 3 points [-]

If it isn't even useful to describe markets being opposed then there isn't much of a political battle happening, is there?

Comment author: Manfred 21 June 2012 01:06:07PM *  -1 points [-]

The label can still have political use even if it doesn't have practical use.

For an example, let's go with Wiggins, people with green eyes and black hair. Wiggins are untrustworthy, and put too much ketchup on their fries, everyone knows that. A minor political party could even sprout up in Australia on a Wiggin-centric platform. But then some statisticians raise the point that we don't have strong evidence differentiating Wiggins from other people. What does the political party in Australia do? "If you're not with us, you're with the Wiggins! How can they say there's no difference between you and a Wiggin, when we can so clearly see the difference? Remember to vote to protect Australia from the Wiggins!"

Sure, at some point reality will become inconvenient. But it takes more than mere evidential neutrality to stop the Australian Anti-Wiggin Party - all it means is people have to use their intuitions.