You're looking at Less Wrong's discussion board. This includes all posts, including those that haven't been promoted to the front page yet. For more information, see About Less Wrong.

drethelin comments on Stupid Questions Open Thread Round 4 - Less Wrong Discussion

6 Post author: lukeprog 27 August 2012 12:04AM

You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.

Comments (179)

You are viewing a single comment's thread. Show more comments above.

Comment author: drethelin 28 August 2012 10:10:42AM 4 points [-]

Things people are willing to pay lots of money for are a strong signal to unscrupulous people. Examples abound of people doing scams as investment advice, counterfeiting art, or selling knock-off designer jewelry. Cryonics is something where you pay a lot of money for a service many years down the line. Someone could easily take in cryonics payments for years without ever having to perform a cryopreservation, and only have it become known after they've disappeared with the profits. Alternately, the impossibility of checking results means that a cryonics provider can profit off of shoddy service and equipment, and you might never realize. On these lines, any organization that is unwilling to let you inspect their preservation equipment etc. is suspect in my eyes. Cryonics organizations are also susceptible to drift in motives of their owners. Maybe the creators 10 years ago were serious about cryonics, but if the current CEO or board of directors cares more about optimizing cheap equipment and profits, then that group might become a de facto scam.

Comment author: loup-vaillant 28 August 2012 01:34:10PM 8 points [-]

If I understand correctly, I can extract those flags, in descending order of redness:

  • Their cryopreservation facility does not exist (yet).
  • Their cryopreservation facility is not open to scrutiny.
  • Governance shows signs of "for profit" behaviour, or fail to demonstrate "non profit" behaviour.
  • Governance merely changed, while you trusted the previous one.

That also suggest signs of trustworthiness:

  • Their cryopreservation facility exists and is open to scrutiny.
  • This is a non profit with open and clean accounts.
  • They are researching or implementing technical improvements.

I'd like to have more such green and red flags, but this is starting to look actionable. Thank you.

Comment author: FeepingCreature 28 August 2012 07:00:18PM 4 points [-]

One strong signal that I think some cryonics orgs implement is preferentially hiring people who have family members in storage.

Comment author: gwern 28 August 2012 07:51:23PM 0 points [-]

Or pets.

Comment author: drethelin 28 August 2012 06:14:04PM 3 points [-]

In the longer run, the governance of a cryo organization should be designed to try and prevent drift. I like how Alcor requires board members to be signed up as well as to have relatives or significant others signed up, but this still doesn't work against someone who's actually unscrupulous.