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Jandila comments on Call for Anonymous Narratives by LW Women and Question Proposals (AMA) - Less Wrong Discussion
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Comments (364)
Upvoted for owning up to it.
Yah, I'm not being very clear with that, though it's at least partly because I'm just generally underslept and sick, and have been for a couple of months now, so it's hard to "say what I mean" rather than "verbalize something that's more on-target for what I mean, than not." (Gotta love autie language brain...)
Some of what I'm referring to is just conferences, symposia, guest speaker talks or, yes, actual debates, usually hosted at an academic institution that I or someone I knew was attending. I was particularly uninclined to take anybody's word for much of anything at the time, and insisted on looking into it a bit myself before really trying to interpret what they were upset about .
Some of it is just random discussions with other people over the years, both on and off of LW.
Wait. You've heard people proposing to gently euthanize queers? Can you say in what country and decade, if you don't want to give too much information? I can't see the mercy-killing crowd going against queers, nor the gay-murdering crowd preferring gentle methods to hanging.
I'm also surprised people are still openly supporting involuntary euthanasia after WW2. Forced sterilization isn't even done on whole groups anymore since the seventies.
US, this decade. They weren't euthanasia advocates per se, they were various flavors of fundamentalist in some cases -- but they were polite, non-frothing, non-raving flavors of fundamentalist.
I think the last actual legally forced sterilization in the US was in the early 80s, in Oregon, although some states did keep the laws on the books after that (they simply didn't use them thereafter).
I would find that much easier to believe if I saw non-hearsay evidence -of people advocating euthanasia of queers, in the US, this decade) - either texts written by those people, or a video filmed from a cellphone, or a summary of their position from a reputable institution or something.
(unless you're talking about Wesboro Baptist Church, or anonymous posters on a forum)
According to Largent's "Breeding Contempt" (following Robitscher), all sterilizations in the US in the 70s were in Virginia and none were in the 80s. There are reasons to believe that these are undercounts and earlier Largent had claimed that Oregon had sterilizations after 1965, but as far as I can tell, the widely reported 1981 date stems from a hospital striking the procedure from its books a couple years before the state changed its laws and has nothing to do with actual sterilizations.
Largent's story doesn't accord with testimony from those who were charged with destroying the records of the Oregon Eugenics Board, or the widespread nationwide practice of sterilizing Native American women in BIA hospitals for other procedures (which is barely touched on even in other scholarly treatments of the general phenomenon). The book might sound persuasive to you, but it's not true.
Could you give a more specific citation about Oregon?
Very tricky due to internet sources aging, but here's a snapshot of an article discussing that testimony.
http://web.archive.org/web/20021026095240/http://www.oregonlive.com/news/oregonian/index.ssf?/xml/story.ssf/html_standard.xsl?/base/news/1028030290179750.xml
I don't see where that supports
(unless your disagreement with Douglas_Knight is about something else now)
What do you mean by "testimony"?
I don't believe anyone was charged with destroying records.
The term "testimony" doesn't only refer to legal proceedings.
...
I am confused.
Since Jandila seems to have evaded questions on the claim about euthanasia advocates and the claim about legal forced sterilizations in the eighties, I'm inclined to assume those aren't exactly true, or at least are somewhat exaggerated or deformed.
(though in this specific case, she's probably talking about hypothetical anti-gay-rights activists or something that aren't particularly euthanasia advocates, but are advocating euthanasia of queers or something; so there's no inherent contradiction, I just suspect it didn't happen as described)