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David_Gerard comments on LW Women: LW Online - Less Wrong Discussion

29 [deleted] 15 February 2013 01:43AM

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Comment author: David_Gerard 19 February 2013 10:54:02PM 0 points [-]

It's probably the best possible start. "Am I being a dick?"

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 20 February 2013 06:01:53AM 3 points [-]

Taboo "being a dick".

Comment author: David_Gerard 20 February 2013 08:45:54AM -1 points [-]

In terms of how human minds have evolved to interact with other humans, I think it can usefully be treated as a primitive. Are you actually claiming not to understand what it means, or is this an exercise?

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 21 February 2013 06:04:41AM *  3 points [-]

Different people have different ideas about what constitutes "being a dick" and I was wondering what you mean by it.

Comment author: David_Gerard 21 February 2013 08:35:35AM *  -1 points [-]

I do in fact mean running it past your inbuilt "actually, am I being a dick?" evaluator, as a start. (I'm assuming most people have something that does that job.)

This in no way guarantees anyone else will agree you're not being a dick, as you note, but I find this method useful in practice for screening off my bursts of dickishness - when I remember to apply it - and so I offer it as a simple thing that may work. I find it also makes my responses calmer in a heated argument.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 22 February 2013 02:21:47AM 2 points [-]

I do in fact mean running it past your inbuilt "actually, am I being a dick?" evaluator, as a start. (I'm assuming most people have something that does that job.)

I'm still not sure which inbuilt evaluator you're talking about.

Comment author: David_Gerard 22 February 2013 09:27:57AM *  -2 points [-]

If you are about to say or write a response to something, does "wait, am I actually being a dick here?" before you do so mean anything? Something like "I'm right of course, but can I be right without also coming across as a dick?"

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 23 February 2013 07:02:33AM 2 points [-]

Assume I'm not familiar with the meaning of the word. If I remember correctly where I was growing up 'dick' was little more than a generic insult, also I'm not a native English speaker.

Comment author: David_Gerard 23 February 2013 10:24:52AM 0 points [-]

Ah, OK. Does Don't be a dick get the idea across a bit?

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 24 February 2013 12:48:45AM *  2 points [-]

Ok, looking at the articles much of it talks about how being a dick is not related to being right or being polite and how bad it is to be a dick. As far as talking about what being a dick actually is here is all the article says:

Standard dick-moves, for example, include such things as willfully (but politely) drawing attention to genuine (but inconsequential) errors in spelling or grammar of an interlocutor's comments, disregarding the Chomskian distinction between language competence and language performance.

(..)

Are you here to contribute and make the project good? Or is your goal really to find fault, get your views across [emphasis mine], or be the one in control? Perhaps secretly inside you even enjoy the thrill of a little confrontation.

(..)

Telling someone "Don't be a dick" is generally a dick-move — especially if true. It upsets the other person and reduces the chance that they'll listen to what you say.

Ok, ignoring the line about how attempting to get your views across constitutes being a dick, the idea appears to be a combination of not acting/arguing in good faith and using techniques that are low on Paul Graham's hierarchy of disagreement.

Is this about right?

Also, I suspect the whole "don't be a dick" thing seems like an attempt to create a virtue ethics from scratch by people who never learned traditional virtue ethics.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 20 February 2013 04:27:43PM 1 point [-]

DataPacRat is asking about going beyond not being a dick.

I haven't followed DPR's posts enough to have an opinion about whether it would be good for them to add more friendliness, but a community norm of saying more about what you like about what you've read is probably a good idea.