You're looking at Less Wrong's discussion board. This includes all posts, including those that haven't been promoted to the front page yet. For more information, see About Less Wrong.

Jack comments on The failure of counter-arguments argument - Less Wrong Discussion

14 Post author: Stuart_Armstrong 10 July 2013 01:38PM

You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.

Comments (43)

You are viewing a single comment's thread.

Comment author: Jack 10 July 2013 07:17:46PM 11 points [-]

The flip side of this is the "Failure to Convince" argument. If experts being unable to knock down an argument is evidence for that argument then the argument failing to convince the experts evidence against the argument.

Comment author: Kaj_Sotala 10 July 2013 08:44:16PM 8 points [-]

Assuming, of course, that there is evidence of the experts having actually considered the argument properly, instead of just giving the first or second answer that came to mind in response to it. (Or to be exact, the first-thought-that-came-to-mind dismissal is evidence too, but very weak such.)

Comment author: David_Gerard 12 July 2013 07:09:47AM 5 points [-]

This is unfortunately reminiscent of the standard LW objection "well, they're only smart in the lab" to any scientist who doesn't support local tropes.

Comment author: wedrifid 12 July 2013 01:37:12PM 1 point [-]

This is unfortunately reminiscent of the standard LW objection "well, they're only smart in the lab" to any scientist who doesn't support local tropes.

I don't believe that is a standard LW objection.

Comment author: DanielLC 10 July 2013 09:43:10PM 4 points [-]

It's only strong evidence if there's a good chance that a good argument will convince them. Would you expect a good argument to convince an expert creationist that he's wrong?

Comment author: Stuart_Armstrong 11 July 2013 08:47:53AM 1 point [-]

Yes, this is correct (on conservation of expected evidence, if nothing else: if experts were all convinced, then we'd believe the argument more).

Now, there's a whole host of reasons to suspect that the experts are not being rational with the AI risk argument (and if we didn't have those reasons, we'd be even more worried!), but the failure to convince experts is a (small) worry. Especially so with experts who have really grappled with the arguments and still reject them (though I can only think of one person in that category: Robin Hanson).