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Astazha comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, March 2015, chapter 114 + chapter 115 - Less Wrong Discussion

3 Post author: Gondolinian 03 March 2015 06:02PM

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Comment author: Velorien 03 March 2015 11:54:03PM 24 points [-]

Let me have a go at coming up with a dozen:

  • Get rid of Harry's wand (as mentioned)
  • Remove Harry's glasses (which could have been a transfigured anything, and Voldemort had just taught Harry how to dispel transfiguration by mere physical contact)
  • Bind or paralyse Harry, with rope or a Death Eater spell
  • Have a Death Eater Imperius Harry with a command to obey Voldemort and do nothing else
  • Have a Death Eater use a Confundus Charm on Harry to make him trust Voldemort and not look for ways to escape
  • Blind Harry - he doesn't need his eyes to tell Voldemort his secrets, just his ears and tongue
  • On the same principle, Voldemort could happily dismember him, as long as magic was used to prevent death from blood loss or shock, and distraction from pain
  • Drain Harry of magic by forcing him to cast innocuous spells
  • Use illusions to disguise the number and location of the Death Eaters so that Harry is unable to come up with targeted countermeasures against them (and so are any unexpected rescuers)
  • Cast a spell on Hermione as a dead man's switch - something that will not permanently hurt/kill her unless Harry does something to incapacitate Voldemort and prevent him from dispelling it in time (not violating Voldemort's promise, since he does not expect Harry to do this)
  • Have one of Voldemort's innumerable horcruxes and a tied-up victim on hand so that he can come back immediately if killed (if there's a mandatory time delay, Harry doesn't know it, so this is at least a powerful bluff)
  • Bring in some hostages, and kill one each time Harry starts doing anything that sounds like playing for time rather than being maximally cooperative

That took me about 15-20 minutes.

Comment author: Astazha 04 March 2015 07:37:38PM 7 points [-]

I'm with everyone else on the wand thing. It would have been simple enough to have him drop it. One narrative explanation for getting the wand back into Harry's hand would have been V asking for a demonstration of PT after Harry told him of it. Another would be to throw away the simplest timeline thing and let time-turned Harry come to the rescue with that solution, wand, cloak, etc. in hand. Though I don't know why V left him an hour on the time-turner either.

But:

My real confusion starts way before all of this. You have the idiot-child of prophesied destruction, and what you do not do is back him into a corner where he may decide to do something desperate. Making Harry feel threatened was a big risk to take with that prophecy.

V transforms into a super scary villain, putting Harry under massive duress, the exact kind of thing that would possibly cause him to destroy the world through time paradox or some other unknown power. It would have made more sense to bind him with an unbreakable vow long before then, to maintain the pretense of friendship throughout. So he guessed you're Voldemort, fine. Come clean, acknowledge what your plan to rule Britain was, and that you have been planning to place Harry as the ruler this time. Have that discussion. Come clean about the existence of a prophecy. Tell him you intend to resurrect Hermione. That you need to know what secret power he has so you can help him avoid the inadvertent destruction of the entire universe. Remind him of the centaur prophecy. Get him on your side that he is a serious risk to everyone. Brief the Death Eaters ahead of time, have a few that Harry doesn't know present out of uniform for a fake ritual of divination that supposedly requires him to be completely nude and holding no objects. At the agreed upon time in the ritual they all just AK him and Harry dies with his eyes wide going "Wait, WHAT?" and thinking you were his friend until the last.

V broadcasts his betrayal so far in advance, and that seems downright unsafe given what is at stake and what a giant question mark this boy is. You underestimate a 1st year, sure. But you don't underestimate a 1st year who is prophesied to destroy the stars and you, who you know has unknown powers.

I'm not hating though, EY. You're writing the story, not me. I know it's taken a lot of effort and I've enjoyed it immensely and I thank you for taking all of this time to write what has essentially been a free novel for all of us to consume and form a community around. I don't usually even think that hard about the fiction I read, but your story invites me to do so. It's been a great experience and I look forward to the finish.

Comment author: Velorien 04 March 2015 09:55:45PM 6 points [-]

I'm not hating though, EY. You're writing the story, not me. I know it's taken a lot of effort and I've enjoyed it immensely and I thank you for taking all of this time to write what has essentially been a free novel for all of us to consume and form a community around. I don't usually even think that hard about the fiction I read, but your story invites me to do so. It's been a great experience and I look forward to the finish.

Definitely worth saying. I know I'm being very critical in this thread, but that's largely because I'm so emotionally invested in this story, which in turn is because it's an extraordinarily good story.

Comment author: Astazha 04 March 2015 10:05:24PM 1 point [-]

I missed when writing this that there was the curse preventing V from killing H. But he still could have just let the centaur kill him. If the curse also stopped him from allowing the death of H then he still could have tried to get the Unbreakable Vow from Harry before making shit hit the fan.