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Lumifer comments on Happy Petrov Day - Less Wrong Discussion

9 Post author: Eneasz 26 September 2015 03:41PM

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Comment author: Lumifer 29 September 2015 01:37:27AM 1 point [-]

I think that the B) case is pretty obvious. In particular, because "makes sense" is a MUCH wider criterion than "supporting and defending the Constitution".

In the specific case of Hering, he was was worried about the President being (temporarily?) insane. Given that he was in no position to make a mental health diagnosis, his position essentially boiled down to saying that his perception of the situation overrides his (presumably) direct orders -- and that's not because the President suddenly became a domestic enemy and a threat to the Constitution.

Comment author: Vaniver 29 September 2015 01:55:21AM 0 points [-]

In particular, because "makes sense" is a MUCH wider criterion than "supporting and defending the Constitution".

Then.... why did you say it?

Comment author: Lumifer 29 September 2015 03:04:51AM 1 point [-]

Because I don't think that Hering's preemptive grab of authority ("I will use or not use the nukes depending of what I think is right regardless of what my orders say") falls under "supporting and defending the Constitution". I think it falls under "makes sense to me".

Comment author: Vaniver 30 September 2015 12:33:07AM 0 points [-]

I don't see where your "preemptive grab of authority" characterization is coming from. Officers are not obligated to follow illegal orders; the established doctrine is that they will be held liable if they do so--that they were simply following orders is no defense. That is, they are only supposed to follow orders that "make sense" to them (in a legal and moral, not strategic, sense).

Yes, it's correct that Petrov's resistance was technical and Hering's resistance was moral, and we / the government may have different opinions on how to react to technical or moral resistance. But my point is that Hering is reacting to an inconsistency in the government's approach (simultaneously binding its officers to defy and not to defy), not adding a novel inconsistency on his own.