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Houshalter comments on Open Thread Feb 22 - Feb 28, 2016 - Less Wrong Discussion

5 Post author: Elo 21 February 2016 09:14PM

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Comment author: gjm 24 February 2016 02:33:08PM *  2 points [-]

I'm not sure Eric is denying common descent (the subject of your last link). My impression is that he's some sort of theistic evolutionist, is happy with the idea that all today's life on earth is descended from a common ancestor[1] but thinks that where the common ancestor came from, and how it was able to give rise to the living things we see today given "only" a few billion years and "only" the size of the earth's biosphere, are questions with no good naturalistic answer, and that God is the answer to both.

[1] Or something very similar; perhaps there are scenarios with a lot of "horizontal transfer" near the beginning, in which the question "one common ancestor or several?" might not even have a clear meaning.

[EDITED because I wrote "Erik" instead of "Eric"; my brain was probably misled by the "k" in the surname. Sorry, Eric.]

Comment author: Houshalter 24 February 2016 05:41:43PM 0 points [-]

Only the last link is about common descent. And it isn't agnostic on theistic evolution; there's a whole section on experiments for testing evolution through Random Mutation and Natural Selection. The first link covers abiogenesis, and the second the evolution of complicated structures like the flagellum.

I don't think theistic evolution is that much more rational than standard creationism. It's like someone realized the evidence for evolution was overwhelming, but was unable to completely update their beliefs.

Comment author: gjm 24 February 2016 05:49:21PM 1 point [-]

Only the last link is about common descent.

That would by why I called it "the subject of your last link" rather than, say, "the subject of all your links".

there's a whole section on experiments for testing evolution through Random Mutation and Natural Selection.

I do not think anything on that page says very much about whether the evolution of life on earth (including in particular human life) has benefited from occasional tinkering by a god or gods. (For the avoidance of doubt: I am very confident it hasn't.)

I don't think theistic evolution is that much more rational than standard creationism.

I think it's quite a bit better -- the inconsistencies with other things we have excellent evidence for are subtler -- but that wasn't my point. I was just trying to avoid arguments with strawmen. If Erik accepts common descent, there is little point directing him to a page listing evidence for common descent as if that refutes his position.