ChristianKl comments on Rationality Quotes April 2014 - LessWrong

8 Post author: elharo 07 April 2014 05:25PM

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Comment author: ChristianKl 01 April 2014 12:25:42PM 1 point [-]

You have justified Charlie Manson. If it's true for you, why isn't it true for them?

That leaves the question of how Penn actually knows that Chalie Manson was acting based on what his heart was telling him.

Psychopaths are frequently bad at empathy or "listening to their hearts". It might even be the defining characteristic of what makes someone a psychopath.

Comment author: tegid 01 April 2014 02:44:48PM 1 point [-]

You missed the point entirely. 'Listening to their (own) hearts' is not empathy, it's just giving credibility to your instinctive beliefs, regardless of wether they have a basis or not. How is believing that everyone is connected by a network of magical energy tethers and acting according to that any different than believing that my soul will be saved if I massacre 40 people and acting on that?

The only difference is the actual acts that you take due to the beliefs. Mind you, it's a very important difference, but the quote is not talking about that, it's talking about beliefs themselves and using them as a sufficient justification for acts.

Comment author: ChristianKl 01 April 2014 09:06:26PM -2 points [-]

Listening to their (own) hearts' is not empathy, it's just giving credibility to your instinctive beliefs, regardless of wether they have a basis or not.

I think that plenty of people who call themselves rationalists simply have no idea what listening to one's own heart actually means.

It's like talking with a blind man who has no concept about how green differs from red about how one using a traffic light, to decide when to stop your car. You mean at on time one lamp shown you that you have to stop and at another time it tells you to go ahead? How do you tell the difference?

How is believing that everyone is connected by a network of magical energy tethers and acting according to that any different than believing that my soul will be saved if I massacre 40 people and acting on that?

You basically left out the part about listening to your heart. Having a cognitive belief and making decisions based on mental analysis of the consequences of the belief is not what listening to one's heart is about.

If a human tries to murder another, certain automatic programming fires that dissuades the human from killing. Emotions come up. If you listen to them, you won't kill. You actually have to refuse to listen to your heart to be capable of killing. Maybe there are a few Buddhists who manage to be in a complete state of pure heartfelt love while they ram a knife into someone's else heart but that's very far from what 99.99% of the population is capable of.

In the military soldiers get trained to disassociate the emotions that prevent them from killing others. Psychopaths usually do have a bunch of beliefs about morals. What they lack is the ability to listen to their hearts in a way that guides their actions.

The philosophers of ethics steal more books than other philosophers. It's not clear that well thought out moral beliefs are useful for preventing people from engaging in immoral actions.

The only difference is the actual acts that you take due to the beliefs.

No. Whether or someone is in their head or listens to their heart can matter to the people around him, if those people are perceptive enough to tell the difference. It probably effects most people on an unconscious level.

Comment author: JQuinton 01 April 2014 09:19:12PM 1 point [-]

Listening to your heart just means listening to your innermost desires. It has nothing to do with empathy. Meaning that psychopaths listen to their heart just as much as anyone else. I've never heard anyone use the idiom "listen to your heart" to mean to practice empathy.