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Comment author: somnicule 24 January 2015 12:21:03PM 3 points [-]

I don't think so. They're running on the blockchain, which slows them down. The primary decision-making mechanisms for them are going to basically be the same as can be used for existing organizations, like democracy, prediction markets, etc. Unless you think your bank or government is going to become a seed AI, there's not that much more to DAOs.

Comment author: DanielVarga 24 January 2015 11:36:42PM *  3 points [-]

They're running on the blockchain, which slows them down.

They can follow the advice of any off-the-blockchain computational process if that is to their advantage. They can even audit this advice, so that they don't lose their autonomy. For example, Probabilistically Checkable Proofs are exactly for that setup: when a slow system has to cooperate with an untrusted but faster other. There's the obvious NP case, when the answer by Merlin (the AI) can be easily verified by Arthur (the blockchain). But the classic IP=PSPACE result says that this kind of cooperation can work in much more general cases.

The primary decision-making mechanisms for them are going to basically be the same as can be used for existing organizations, like democracy, prediction markets, etc.

These are just the typical use cases proposed today. In principle, their decision-making mechanism can be anything whatsoever, and we can expect that there will be many of them competing for resources.

The thing that I think makes them interesting from a FAI perspective is the "autonomous" part. They can buy and sell and build stuff. They have agency, they can be very intelligent, and they are not human.

...Okay, that sounded a bit too sensationalist, so let me clarify. Personally, I am much more optimistic regarding UFAI issues than MIRI or median LW. I don't actually argue that DAOs are dangerous. What I argue is that if someone is interested in how very smart, autonomous computational processes could arise in the future, this possible path might be worth investigating a bit.

Comment author: DanielVarga 24 January 2015 11:32:28AM *  1 point [-]

An advanced DAO (decentralized/distributed autonomous organization), the way Vitalik images it, is a pretty believable candidate for an uncontrolled seed AI, so I'm not sure Eliezer and co shares Vitalik's apparent enthusiasm regarding the convergence of these two sets of ideas.

Comment author: satt 23 June 2014 03:11:06AM 2 points [-]

Cosma Shalizi, in bookmarking Scott's post, offers some specific, relevant references to Plato (and some amusing tags).

Comment author: DanielVarga 23 June 2014 08:43:00PM *  2 points [-]

I was unsurprised but very disappointed when it turned out there are no other posts tagged one_mans_vicious_circle_is_another_mans_successive_approximation. But Shalizi has already used the joke once in his lecture notes on Expectation Maximization.

Comment author: DanielVarga 31 May 2014 10:15:36AM 3 points [-]

Tononi gives a very interesting (weird?) reply: Why Scott should stare at a blank wall and reconsider (or, the conscious grid), where he accepts the very unintuitive conclusion that an empty square grid is conscious according to his theory. (Scott's phrasing: "[Tononi] doesn’t “bite the bullet” so much as devour a bullet hoagie with mustard.") Here is Scott's reply to the reply:

Giulio Tononi and Me: A Phi-nal Exchange

Comment author: chaosmage 28 May 2014 03:21:40PM 0 points [-]

It gets complicated if you do not draw an arbitrary border where matter becomes part of your body and where it ceases to do so.

Comment author: DanielVarga 29 May 2014 08:30:28PM 0 points [-]

I have no problem with an arbitrary border. I wouldn't even have a problem with, for example, old people gradually shrinking in size to zero just to make the image more aesthetically pleasing.

Comment author: RichardKennaway 25 May 2014 11:40:28AM 16 points [-]

The Trans-Siberian Railway runs for more than 9000 kilometres between Moscow and Vladivostok. Is the Moscow end "the same thing as" the Vladivostok end? Are they "the same thing as" its passage through Novosibirsk?

If one is not puzzled by these conundrums about an object extended in space, I see no reason to be puzzled over the "identity" of an object extended in time, such as a human life.

Pinero pursed his lips and considered. "No doubt you are all familiar with the truism that life is electrical in nature. Well, that truism isn't worth a damn, but it will help to give you an idea of the principle. You have also been told that time is a fourth dimension. Maybe you believe it, perhaps not. It has been said so many times that it has ceased to have any meaning. It is simply a cliché that windbags use to impress fools. But I want you to try to visualize it now, and try to feel it emotionally."

He stepped up to one of the reporters. "Suppose we take you as an example. Your name is Rogers, is it not? Very well, Rogers, you are a space-time event having duration four ways. You are not quite six feet tall, you are about twenty inches wide and perhaps ten inches thick. In time, there stretches behind you more of this space-time event, reaching to, perhaps, 1905, of which we see a cross section here at right angles to the time axis, and as thick as the present. At the far end is a baby, smelling of sour milk and drooling its breakfast on its bib. At the other end lies, perhaps, an old man some place in the 1980s. Imagine this space-time event, which we call Rogers, as a long pink worm, continuous through the years. It stretches past us here in 1939, and the cross section we see appears as a single, discrete body. But that is illusion. There is physical continuity to this pink worm, enduring through the years. As a matter of fact, there is physical continuity in this concept to the entire race, for these pink worms branch off from other pink worms. In this fashion the race is like a vine whose branches intertwine and send out shoots. Only by taking a cross section of the vine would we fall into the error of believing that the shootlets were discrete individuals."

Robert Heinlein, "Life-line"

Comment author: DanielVarga 25 May 2014 02:07:08PM 3 points [-]

Wow, I'd love to see some piece of art depicting that pink worm vine.

Comment author: CellBioGuy 25 February 2014 08:27:12PM 3 points [-]

Is there a family history of this? If so that would skew my assessment towards that of the first doctor. If not, seriously another opinion...

Comment author: DanielVarga 25 February 2014 10:55:49PM 1 point [-]

No family history.

Comment author: Pfft 25 February 2014 05:30:46PM 2 points [-]

Can you ask the second doctor to examine you to at least the same standard as the first one?

Maybe someone on Less Wrong who has access to UpToDate can send you a copy of their glaucoma page, for an authoritative list of pros and cons.

Comment author: DanielVarga 25 February 2014 10:55:29PM 1 point [-]

Can you ask the second doctor to examine you to at least the same standard as the first one?

Unfortunately, no. See my answer to Lumifer.

Comment author: polymathwannabe 25 February 2014 06:28:48PM -1 points [-]
Comment author: DanielVarga 25 February 2014 10:54:29PM *  0 points [-]

What he proposed is in fact laser iridotomy, although they called it laser iridectomy.

Comment author: Lumifer 25 February 2014 07:52:41PM 4 points [-]

My impression is that glaucoma (which is, basically, too high intraocular pressure) is easy to diagnose. Two doctors disagreeing on it would worry me.

Don't get just a third independent opinion, get a fourth one as well.

Comment author: DanielVarga 25 February 2014 10:54:16PM 1 point [-]

It was less than a disagreement. I'm sorry that I over-emphasized this point. The first time the pressure was Hgmm 26/18, the second time 19/17. The second doctor said that the pressure can fluctuate, and her equipment is not enough to settle the question. (She is an I-don't-know-the-correct-term national health service doctor, the first one is an expensive private doctor with better equipment, and more time for a patient.)

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