Meetup : Tucson, Arizona

0 DeevGrape 04 June 2012 09:49PM

Discussion article for the meetup : Tucson, Arizona

WHEN: 20 June 2012 07:00:00PM (-0700)

WHERE: 2443 North Campbell Avenue

Hey Tucson, After the fun and inspiration of the Rationality Mini-Camp in Berkeley last month, I'm pretty jazzed about rationality, and I'd like to meet some more of my fellow LessWrongers :) So I'll be hanging out in Coffee X Change Wednesday the 20th from 7 to 10, and anyone who's free should come out. I'll be the one with a print-out of the HPMOR cover on my table (http://mike-obee-lay.deviantart.com/art/Harry-Potter-and-the-Methods-of-Rationality-Cover-280590525) We'll be talking about some of the information that was covered at the Mini-Camp, especially how to apply rationality to your own life and decisions; but I'm sure conversation will wander immensely. (Oh, and if you like in-group-out-group conflicts, then just look at Phoenix, with their LW meetup on the 15th... you don't want to let them win, do you? Tucson Uber Alles!)

Discussion article for the meetup : Tucson, Arizona

Comment author: DeevGrape 04 June 2012 09:35:35PM 1 point [-]

Me and an interested friend (both in Tucson) are planning to make the trip down (up?) for this meeting. If there's anyone else who might be up for the carpool/road trip... hit me up.

Comment author: DeevGrape 01 June 2012 08:54:20PM 5 points [-]

My changes in fashion have been wildly successful. Hanging out with two separate friend groups the week after mini-camp, I was complimented repeatedly on how snazzy my new look was and how I was suddenly fashionable. They asked what happened and I said "I went to San Francisco!"

Even better evidence: I went to a bar with a friend last week, wearing a blazer, black slacks, nice shoes, and a decent T-shirt. We got stopped by the bouncer, and he said they had a strict dress code: no athletic shorts, no plain white t-shirts, etc. (basically my friend's entire outfit). He said "This guy's dressed to the core, and you're violating the whole dress code!"

I'm maintaining my habit of studying Calculus on my own using Khan Academy videos, and have a no-money graph up on Beeminder. I've logged about 20 hours, in addition to Precalc videos (so probably over 25 hours), and with no calculus training prior to two weeks ago, I got a 53/100 on a Calc 1 final exam. So, not perfect yet, but certainly astonishing progress in my mind.

This week I went into a complete slump triggered by a hangover on Monday and a difficult piece of schoolwork with a flexible due date (creating a syllabus). I'm still procrastinating on creating the syllabus.

Comment author: CalmNearEnd 31 May 2012 02:41:59AM 0 points [-]

I downloaded StayFocusd which allows me to have 10 minutes of FaceBook a day and then blocks it and I was playing a computer game too much so I just uninstalled it.

I like this idea of taking action while I'm mindful to prevent myself from doing things that are a waste of time when I'm in normal zombie mode.

Comment author: DeevGrape 01 June 2012 08:38:26PM 0 points [-]

"zombie mode" -- I love this description! Mostly because it reminds me of Professor Quirrell, but still, it definitely describes how I feel when I'm in a procrastination/akrasia/depression cycle. I also have StayFocusd, which I find useful for automatically logging the amount of time I spend doing things I don't care about. It doesn't forcibly stop me from wandering (since it's simple enough to disable), but just knowing that I'm eating up my "leisure time" is enough to keep me doing things that are at least pseudo-productive.

Comment author: DeevGrape 16 May 2012 06:53:41PM 7 points [-]

Hello, fellow minicampers, this is Ethan! Hello to everyone else too :)

Monday night a few of us went blues dancing, and rather than being all awkward like I've done in the past, I used Critch's smile association method and ended up really enjoying myself!

And I spent the 14-16 hour drive from San Francisco back to Tucson with excellent posture (based on Luke and Cat's recommendation that it made me look fantastic), smiling and thinking something like "Yeah, I'm a badass," every time I thought of my posture to make a positive association with posture and with self-modification.

Just started using remember the milk, and I made a list of priorities / medium and short term goals using freemind.

Comment author: ArisKatsaris 11 April 2012 11:11:58AM 12 points [-]

I think you're underestimating how quick people are to latch onto a detected pattern at the tiniest bit of evidence, and highly overestimating how quick they're to let go of the pattern they (brilliantly) detected when evidence to the contrary appears.

Any date at around that era will keep making people think she identified him as Tom Riddle, no matter any other evidence to the contrary, unless you explicitly have her mention a different name for him by chapter's end.

If you don't want people to have that confusion by chapter's end, just edit the chapter to have her name him with whatever non-Tom-Riddle name she thinks him to be.

Comment author: DeevGrape 11 April 2012 05:29:10PM 2 points [-]

Said by Quirrell, but appropriate to the question of EY publishing the name of the hero: "it is clear he does not wish the fact announced, and has reasons enough for silence. "

Comment author: falenas108 05 April 2012 02:42:03AM 1 point [-]

Although it is better to use Bayesian probabilities to keep track of who you think is a spy, in a normal game it is advantageous to appear sure that you know who the spy is. By appearing sure, you are more likely to convince other people, which means you get to stay in the game longer and you're more likely to catch the spy, assuming you're part of the resistance.

Comment author: DeevGrape 05 April 2012 03:26:01AM 2 points [-]

Seeming sure of who the spies are is a strong strategy -- but it's equally strong whether you're resistance or a spy. Accurate Bayesian reasoning is only a strong strategy for the resistance, since spies don't want the truth to come out. Spies want to lie either way, but it's much easier to lie in a finger-pointing contest than in a discussion of evidence and probability updating.

Using explicit Bayesian reasoning is less likely to lead your teammates into bad judgments of the kind I touched on (stemming from over/under-confidence), and it gives your teammates evidence that you are resistance.

Bayesianism and use of Evidence in Social Deduction Games

13 DeevGrape 05 April 2012 12:55AM

You look around the table at four friends -- people who share your hatred for the evil empire, or so you thought. At this table, where the resistance meet to plan their missions, fully two of five the operatives are spies, infiltrating the rebels to sabotage their missions. You've seen your loyalty card, so you know you're resistance... but how do you figure out which of your so-called allies are the spies?

The Resistance, like Werewolf, Mafia, Battlestar Galactica, and other social deduction games, tasks the majority of players with rooting out the spies in their midst -- while the spies win by staying hidden. Among my friends, accusations of spyhood tend to be absolute: "Did you see how long he hesitated? He must be a spy!" Whether the suspicion is based on social cues or in-game actions, players rapidly become very sure of those beliefs they discuss at the table. They seem to divide their observations into two neat boxes, based on whether the data can decisively show someone's identity. If evidence seems convincing, it becomes concrete proof, immune to discussion; and if it doesn't, then it's disregarded. 

This treatment of evidence can lead to overconfidence: once when I was well-framed by the spies, my fellow resistance member refused to even imagine how I could be innocent. And why should he listen to me? He had evidence that I was a spy. On the other hand, it can just as easily lead to under-confidence: when new players see that there is no conclusive proof one way or the other, they often disregard the hints and suggestive evidence (in someone's tone of voice, or their eagerness to go on a mission), and throw their hands up at the supposed randomness of the game. 

Using Bayesianism as an alternative to this dichotomy allows me to treat evidence with the appropriate scrutiny, rather than using narrative ideas to guide my play. A two-person mission succeeds; the next mission adds a player to that team, and it fails. According to story logic, the first two players are trustworthy, so the third must have sabotaged the new mission. For more experienced players, the first mission is treated as having no informational value: spies may lay low, so any of the three players could be the saboteur, and it's a 1/3 shot. According to Bayesianism, P(player 3 is a spy) is influenced by all available evidence, given proper weighting. How likely is it for a spy to lay low on the first mission? Who chose for player 3 to join the mission? What is player 3's strategy as a spy? I find that this approach, of investigating all available evidence and updating my suspicions accordingly, allows me to have better precision in my accusations, and hopefully leads my teammates to start valuing evidence in the gradient way that these games, and investigation in life in general, requires for success.

 

I post this not only because I love playing Resistance (obviously!), but also because I think this game could be a fun and useful exercise in Bayesian reasoning, for the same reasons that Paranoid Debating may be: the group's appraisal of the evidence needs to be accurate for the resistance to win, while it must be inaccurate for the spies to win. This encourages proper Bayesian technique among the resistance, and clever, bias-abusing rhetoric from the spies to twist the game in their favor. 

If anyone would like to use this game at a LessWrong meetup, or as an activity run by the Center for Modern Rationality, all you need are the rules (here and here), a deck of playing cards, and the power of Bayes!

 

(Special thanks to Julia Galef, for thinking the game sounded like a fun idea for teaching Bayesianism)

Comment author: Vaniver 28 March 2012 04:47:40AM *  4 points [-]

Scrimgeour seems like a likely candidate for the strange male voice.

Comment author: DeevGrape 28 March 2012 04:51:46AM 19 points [-]

Or, depending on how the interrogation went, ScrimQuirMort.

Comment author: DeevGrape 18 February 2012 09:45:19PM 0 points [-]

Yeah, I neglected to make sure next weekend would actually work for me... I was just thinking, "This is far out in the future," but I have plans as well. Yay, good first impressions. :-/

I'll reschedule this for Friday the 2nd, and in the mean time I'll check out the recommendations from ojspires.

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