240 questions for your utility function

2 HumanitiesResearcher 21 June 2013 05:56PM

A game comparing intrinsic values can approximate a person's utility function.


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Comment author: DaFranker 19 April 2013 01:33:07PM 3 points [-]

This is a problem that machine learning can tackle. Feel free to contact me by PM for technical help.

Good point!

Also yay combining multiple fields of knowledge and expertise! applause

Seriously though, the world does need more of it, and I felt the need to explicitly reward and encourage this.

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 22 April 2013 07:58:27PM 0 points [-]

Thanks! I feel explicitly encouraged.

Comment author: gwern 18 April 2013 04:26:36PM 1 point [-]

So to retreat to the earlier question, why does my proposal strike you as a GIGO situation?

You claimed to not know what printers there were, how many there were, and what connection they had to 'Marks'. In such a situation, what on earth do you think you can infer at all? You have to start somewhere: 'we have good reason to believe there were not more than 20 printers, and we think the London printer usually messed up the last page. Now, from this we can start constructing these phylogenetic trees indicating the most likely printers for our sample of books...' There is no view from nowhere, you cannot pick yourself up by your bootstraps, all observation is theory-laden, etc.

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 21 April 2013 04:27:25PM 0 points [-]

This all sounds good to me. In fact, I believe that researchers in the humanities are especially (perhaps overly) sensitive to the reciprocal relationship between theory and observation.

I may have overstated the ignorance of the current situation. The scholarly community has already made some claims connecting the Big Book to Print Shops [x,y,z]. The problem is that those claims are either made on non-quantitative bases (eg, "This mark seems characteristic of this Print Shop's status.") or on a very naive frequentist basis (eg, "This mark comes up N times, and that's a big number, so it must be from Print Shop X"). My project would take these existing claims as priors. Is that valid?

Comment author: beoShaffer 18 April 2013 05:20:18AM 0 points [-]

I was openly warned by a professor (who will likely be on the dissertation committee) not to talk about this project widely.

Did they say why?

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 21 April 2013 04:23:22PM 3 points [-]

Yes. He said that I should be careful about sharing my project because, otherwise, I'll be reading about it in a journal in a few months. His warning may exaggerate the likelihood of a rival researcher and mis-value the expansion of knowledge, but I'm deferring to him as a concession of my ignorance, especially regarding rules of the academy.

Comment author: Vaniver 17 April 2013 04:20:38PM 4 points [-]

Right, but this isn't a free lunch so much as "you can see a lot by looking."

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 18 April 2013 05:29:38AM 4 points [-]

Sorry to interrupt a perfectly lovely conversation. I just have a few things to add:

  • I may have overstated the case in my first post. We have some information about print shops. Specifically, we can assign very small books to print shops with a high degree of confidence. (The catch is that small books don't tend to survive very well. The remaining population is rare and intermittent in terms of production date.)

  • There are some hypotheses that could be treated as priors, but they're very rarely quantified (projects like this are rare in today's humanities).

Comment author: PrawnOfFate 17 April 2013 02:16:59PM 2 points [-]

But Humanities has rejected that!

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 18 April 2013 05:22:35AM 0 points [-]

Yep. It's not the Bible. I suspect that there are already good stats compiled on the Q-source, etc.

In a way it's not only futile but limiting to play the guessing game. There are lots of possible applications of Bayesian methods to the humanities. Maybe this discussion will help more projects than my own.

Comment author: EHeller 17 April 2013 06:26:47PM 1 point [-]

If you assume that the marks result from defects in the tool that accumulate, it should be relatively easy to build (and test) a monotonic model

The first assumption seems bad to me- I would assume defects accumulate only until equipment is reset or repaired, which is why I think you'd want some actual data.

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 18 April 2013 05:18:51AM 0 points [-]

Yes, I see an accord between your statement and Vaniver's. As I said below, most tools have very slow repair cycles.

Comment author: Kindly 17 April 2013 04:07:59PM 4 points [-]

I dunno, I find the complexity-hiding capitalized nouns things strangely attractive. Maybe there should be more capitalized nouns. Why isn't Sheets capitalized?

This is probably coming back to my fascination with graph theory, which has similar but even more exotic terminology. "A spider is a subdivision of a star, which is a kind of tree made up only of leaves and a root; a star with three arcs is called a claw."

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 18 April 2013 05:17:47AM 1 point [-]

I was openly warned by a professor (who will likely be on the dissertation committee) not to talk about this project widely.

The capitalized nouns are to highlight key terms. I believe the current description is specific enough to describe the situation accurately and without misleading people, but not too specific to break my professor's (correct) advice.

Have I broken LW protocol? Obviously, I'm new here.

Comment author: gwern 18 April 2013 01:04:52AM 0 points [-]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_%28machine_learning%29 A specific concrete variable you can code up, like 'total number of commas'.

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 18 April 2013 05:12:18AM 1 point [-]

I have just such a thing, referred to as "Marks." I haven't yet included that in the code, because I wanted to explore the viability of the method first. So to retreat to the earlier question, why does my proposal strike you as a GIGO situation?

Comment author: Vaniver 17 April 2013 04:20:25PM 2 points [-]

I just noticed a mistake in your summary. Each sheet is produced by a set of tools, not a single tool. Each mark is produced by a single tool.

Okay. Are the classes of marks distinct by tool type- that is, if I see a mark on a sheet, I know whether it came from tool type X or tool type Y- or do we need to try and discover what sort of marks the various tools can leave?

Comment author: HumanitiesResearcher 18 April 2013 12:54:07AM 3 points [-]

Fortunately, we know which tool types leave which marks. We also have a very strong understanding of the ways in which tools break and leave marks.

Thanks again for entertaining this line of inquiry.

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