.t might take a while to figure out what works and what doesn't,
What worked well for you?
.t might take a while to figure out what works and what doesn't,
What worked well for you?
Agreement on CBHacking's points.
I found the match factor to be very predictive. With an ex-boyfriend of mine, the boyfriend I found via okc and a more recent one I had 99% match, though the maximum height of the match factor is constrained by amount of questions answered and the way you answer them, so you might not get that high in the first place. 95% is really decent, I never found anyone <80% interesting enough to talk to for longer.
For the enemy thing I recommend checking the answers marked "unacceptable" that go into the factor calculation. Sometimes these come merely from interpreting a question differently.
I'm open to describing which strategies would work for me (24, female, white, European), but I am not sure how much they generalise. I rely on profile text quite heavily for getting an impression of the other person and will often send the first message. I'm informed that isn't typical though.
Some types of messages I got: 1.) mass messages Just "Hi" or "Hi :)" or "Hi how r u" or similar. These are very common. I tried to talk to some of those people and the conversations tended to be extremely boring, uncreative and the people lacked raw intelligence (e.g. they would not understand irony).
2.) creepy and/or sexual (mass) messages The usual expected "Are u into casual sex?" or similar, but also "I like your white skin". I haven't seen people be creepy on purpose. But my experience on the site might have been somewhat more sheltered than average.
[Edit: Actually looked through my old messages, found some examples. I think the second person counts as "creepy on purpose. http://i.imgur.com/3eRozU9.png and http://i.imgur.com/iAX9Id9.png ]
My general observation was that > 70% of the people who send short messages appeared to lack what I would have considered baseline intelligence. Some of them are also incredibly desperate. I haven't seen a lot of unfriendly messages and most of them could be declared my own doing, since I tended to get impatient in situations where people evidently didn't read a single line of my profile (e.g. asking "are you single?" when this is literally in the header of your profile).
3.) profile-related comments Not always for dating, just pointing out a single thing they liked or asking a single question. Really appreciated, might lead to talking more but in my experience these often weren't dating-related.
4.) more elaborate (up to several paragraphs) messages Always with reference to something I wrote on my profile. Generally friendly, intelligent people, I enjoyed the conversations (and friendships) resulting from this.
If she has a long profile text, a reference to or question about one or more of those things is strongly recommended. That's what the thing is for - if you don't find any of it interesting, you probably won't find her interesting either. Writing long texts costs a lot of time, so it's disappointing to see people just skip it.
I didn't spend a whole lot of time on okc available, but during that time I got ~8 messages a day. I tried to answer all the longer ones, but it's painful to turn people away and I personally understand if people don't reply at all even to a multiple-paragraph-message. Maybe that helps with understanding the large amount of "silent rejections". I'd recommend making a first message not longer than 2 paragraphs, so you don't have so much sunk cost.
Personally I solved the flood of messages by asking people to send me a short message, after which I'd take a look at their profile and answer if I was interested. This was optimal for me since it reduced the guilt over not answering carefully-crafted messages and I was judging based on profile anyways.
There's an excellent longer post somewhere on LW about how to write a good profile. Okc itself has a few interesting blog posts e.g. about the optimal length of a first message. I'm open to answering questions should that be useful.
There is a huge confounding factor - looks. Most sites are hugely photo focused. So the women who look good on photos get contacted by hundreds of men. Generally most issues boil down to this.
For me narrowing my search to women without photos worked really well, and I did it on a "traditional" site (it does not necessarily mean being ugly, just shy or not wanting to be judged by looks).
Now there are even sites specialized for this such as Willow and PersonalityMatch.
I have not tried Willow - no need to, I am sold - but it sounds like really something I would use.
I can confirm that for my case - when I (female) removed my picture from Okcupid, it had the (desirable, then) effect that I didn't get any messages whatsoever anymore, over the space of ~6 months. I might have gotten a non-zero amount if I hadn't stated on my profile that I wasn't looking for relationships at the time, but even with that clear statement I still got messages every once in a while during the time I had the picture up. I didn't try experimenting with a more/less attractive picture.
I got the impression that many people just look at the profile and don't even check the relationship status at the top of the profile.
I wouldn't recommend online dating. Stats released by various online dating sites reveal that there are usually far more men than (active) women, the women get a couple of orders of magnitude more attention than the men do, and a significant fraction of people on these sites actually never get to meet anyone there in person. There have been some recent attempts at apps/sites aimed at solving these problems but I'm not aware of any that have been particularly successful. I'd love to be proven wrong though as my information about online dating is from 1-2 years ago.
I'd have liked you to phrase the first sentence as "I wouldn't recommend online dating to men."
I mean, I'm aware that there are 10-15% women on this site, but let's not accidentally exclude them. Especially for nerdy/geeky/intellectual women, okcupid is in my experience a really great place. I got the impression that I was able to find people that were much more similar to me than anyone else I knew from my university environment - which lead to a few friendships and my longest relationship to date.
It's true that my male friends' experiences were usually less successful. It doesn't have to be your only strategy though.
Were you doing this hugs stuff that was mentioned in the thread about the last one? I wasn't there, but I wonder what is the point, this kind of sentimental, emotional stuff. Does this kind of emotional closeness help the exchange of ideas and information? I would think it is the opposite that helps it: being very impersonal, on surname terms and so on. I mean emotional closeness could faciliate exchange of the "X is really cool, just because I have good feelings about X" type, and you probably don't want it, you probably want exchange of the "X is really useful, because evidence" type and I would think some "coldness" helps more there. Or where did the idea come from? Was the opposite idea (distance, formality,surname terms etc.) tested previously?
However on a meta level I approve of tags, as they are Tell Culture and if they very idea of hugs and emotional closeness comes up at all, tell-culture is probably the only non-awkward way to handle it.
Christian and Richard already addressed your concerns well. Yes, this was a community event, not a conference. We wanted people to find friends and create (deep) connections - you don't get that nearly as much with intellectual conversations.
We're not rational agents, but sophisticated apes, more or less. Most people have social needs for security, closeness, empathy, sharing emotions and so on. We were trying to address that by introducing the relating games and a space for relaxing and cuddling, while (hopefully) not pressuring anyone to participate. It seems that overall we succeeded at this.
It appears that you need to be logged in from FB or twitter to be fully non-guest. That seems like a... strange... choice for an anti-akrasia tool.
(Tangentially related to above, not really a reply)
As tkadlubo says, most people choose to visit as guests. Otherwise you are free to create an account on tinychat.com and visit the chat after logging in, which is what I do. It allows you to PM people and potentially become a moderator, neither of which are necessary for just participating in the pomodoros.
And maybe, just maybe, this visibility and ensuing popularity will push forward the idea of changing tinychat to something else.
(replying here for visibility)
By the way, Malcolm has fulfilled some of the Study Hall users' wishes by embedding the tinychat hall in his Complice website: http://lesswrong.com/lw/lqz/announcing_the_complice_less_wrong_study_hall/
Unfortunately it's still tinychat and therefore just as buggy, but it now has a timer! And you can see tasks of other users! That means that breaks are cut off somewhat more abruptly, but they no longer run over. Overall the hall got more awesome! Password stays "lw", you don't need to be a Complice user to access the site.
The new room can be found here.
Very much agreed. It makes sense to me because a) the costs and risks of doing so are extremely low, and b) it has the potential to notably improve a couple hundred/thousand people's lives.
I find it to be concerning that rational people can't/don't coordinate to do stuff like this. Of course, the reason may be because there's something I'm overlooking, but I think this is unlikely because a) I personally feel pretty confident and b) the parent comment has 17 upvotes and 0 downvotes, so it seems that others agree.
How would one implement such a thing? Who should I ask to make it happen? I presume someone responsible for the site content, but I don't know who to ask.
... to take this onto a more action-oriented level.
There are now 45 people signed up (including me!) so this will already be the biggest LW meeting ever on the European mainland. However, there's space for a maximum of 80 people. And everyone I've talked to who attended the previous one agreed it was quite awesome!
Technically that wasn't correct at the time you wrote it (since there were 47 attendants at last year's LWCW), but we now certainly have enough to break that record!
This is not an opportunity to exercise creativity, find the most boring stodgy company's ad for a secretary, and copy it. People will be able to read between the lines on everything else (or you can use community slang internally to explain, just not externally).
(I agree with the grandparent, part of "growing up" is adopting boring stodgy professional norms for instrumental rationality reasons).
I don't think it's obvious that would be the best approach.
This forum is as internal as it gets without asking potential candidates via email or in person.
Both approaches are valid, but they optimize to attract different people. The gist that I get from this job ad is that they are looking for someone who is a good assistant while being passionate about effective altruism, willing to help indirectly rather than promote their own ego and eager to find creative ways to improve themselves and Bostrom's workflow. My guess is that they would prefer someone less experienced to a person for whom this is just another assistant job, provided that the less experienced person views the role as a challenge to grow into. If the thing that they are optimizing for is work experience/existing skills, I agree that it would be better to match the writing style to standardized assistant job ads. In that case, they might as well post it on the matching sites. Best would be obviously to have someone who fills all the criteria perfectly, but it's going to be hard to come by a person with extensive experience who does not already have a better project to work on or is willing to accept what I'm sure will be a very low salary.
The description as is was much more interesting to me than a standard job ad would have been. I don't think I would have applied if it had read like the standard job ad. That said, I am not trying to argue the description is perfect, just that I prefer the type of description.
tl;dr: If you want excited people to apply, don't post a boring job ad.
Have there been people with Match>=95% where you didn't reply to their messages? If so, what were the prime reasons?
I don't recall individual messages (it was 4 years ago). Trying to look through my messages folder, but I might have deleted some to save space. There were no longer messages I didn't answer. Usually contact broke off after a few messages though.
Reasons I could imagine for not answering: - looking at their profile, not being particularly interested, wanting to answer out of politeness but continually forgetting to (i.e. other things being more important) - hm, I remember a really nice guy I wrote back and forth with and eventually I stopped answering, partly because he had a really negative outlook on life and that made it uncomfortable to think about the content of the messages. If a first message sparked any negative feelings (maybe if it sounded very desperate?) I might have felt ughy enough about it to not answer.
It doesn't look like that actually happened for first replies, so those are just guesses. Maybe they are reasons for other people to not reply to a first message.
Also, there are not a lot of people with match factor 95% upwards.