What was the previous low?

Because after I went through what is most likely to be a pretty darn good ran workshop with lots of effort put in by actual real people that I will see in those days and to talk to them and to learn some stuff from them and then to say afterwards "sorry, but I don't think that what I learned here is THAT valuable" - to their face (and I have seen their faces, so to put it in a email is a lot like saying it to their face) - that just somehow breaks social convention for me.

There is also the possibility that I consider flying to America and spending 4 days there "scary", and that the monetary price tag is not my actual problem. To fix this, I now imagine the convention was held in Europe.

...

It's not helping, I'd still have to fly. So it's not America that is scary. What if it's in my home country, a long drive (3 hours) away?

...

I can visualize myself looking up further info to see just how long of a trip it is. I can also visualize myself talking to my parents about this. I know the money is something that will be something to talk about my parents. ...

If I think about other long trips, I know my parents will encourage me, because it makes me more independant. They'll help me pack (do you have this, do you have that?).

For the money aspect... they'd have a serious talk with me about it. The ability to refund if it a total sham would help to convince my parents. The fact that it is on a weekend helps reduce the impact as well, it's not a workweek you're taking off. Ultimately they would say it is my own money, that I am a responsible adult now, and that I am the one that should decide for myself. I'd be subject to some heavy questioning about WHY I'd want to go. Due to previous trouble with cults in the family, they'd probably ask questions in that direction - especially after looking CFAR up - a workshop to "think better"...?

I could put my foot down and say I wanted to go and they'd let me.

...

I get the feeling I should visit a meetup or some other rationality-themed event with lower entry requirements first. To get to know how those other people react and respond to things. How welcoming they are. Yes, unjust generalizations, but on the other hand, some parts of those people has to think alike (rational-..istic) and thus it is worth some points as evidence. And whether I can learn anything from talking to people like that, or whether it is a massive circlejerk, so to say.

...

Man I could get half of that by hanging around in some skype meetup. Maybe. Sounds like something that'd be worth to try, given the low effort required.

I don't think my original monetary argument is a false argument - the cost is real - but it's slightly different. $3900 is a lot of money to spend on something that you have no clue of what it'd be like. It looks the same, but basically you can say "hey, this is a car, it goes really fast" and talk to a lot of people who have driven in cars but if you want to buy a car then maybe you should try driving a car first. (This analogy fails horribly due to the fact that you tend to get a drivers license before buying a car. Which involves a lot of driving. So you'd definitely know what a car is.)

I read that in the FAQ as well. ... Weirdly enough, taking that option would make me just feel guilty. I would have gone there, I would have learned, and then I would have said "well this is nice and all but is not as great as I envisioned - it's kinda like counting to 10 instead of immediately screaming at people, and that's not worth all this" - whilst I did get what was offered - lessons, boarding, food, people to talk to... I don't know how to put it. It feels like I'd be hurting other people just to fix my own mistake.

I have prior experience with taking weeks off to learn skills; this is what I did in order to learn for theoretical drivers test.

That said... I didn't mean to do that in this case, as this is material that needs to be tested on individual basis. Focusing on it for a week hard wouldn't be very effective for determining whether it works or not, it would be better to focus on it in order to firmly engrain it in my thinking once I've managed to get it to work sometimes.

As for the whole point "I don't need to spend cash; I can learn this from home", that's probably flawed; what I'm wondering is whether the difference between learning @ home and learning @ workshop is worth the money.

Would you recommend going if it cost $3000 in total? As a healthy "couple-of-years-out-of-college" male I seem like the the type to not get a discount for anything - you're a member of the working force now, you have a job, you have money, it's the standard full price for you, sir! Not that I'm complaining - it makes sense that I'm in that bracket.

For me, $1000 would be a waste if I lost it, but it'd be easy to bounce back from. I lost $1000 in bad decisions before and was affected about as much as if I had publicly with friends embrassed myself - my brain likes to pull it up from time to time but I think of the lesson learned as more valuable than the money lost.

$4000 or $5500 or numbers in that range would be financially not a problem (I lose numbers, but not physical objects like cars or the roof over my head or the office I work at), but emotionally a huge setback.

As for the benefits... That's precisely the sort of thing I'd ask people like you who have gone there.

Those 5 second techniques sound cool, but they also sound like the sort of thing you could read about. Maybe study for a week and practice. My current stance is that I shouldn't go because I have never been to any meetup before and going to one that costs me that much money is probably not so smart - look for a cheaper alternative nearby to increase the value you could get from the workshop. The other main point floating around in my head is that I can already think "well enough" and that spending that money to think better is not effective, and there is other things I should be doing instead. There's an objection to that floating about as well; "You don't know what you don't know", so how can I use my (perhaps flawed) thought process to determine that I am, in fact, thinking well enough - but that's a thought that seemingly has no end to second guessing yourself. I feel like that thought could just arm itself if given better resources - "see, you aren't all that clever - just now, you made a mistake. That's the 7th one this hour."

I am... not all that EA-oriented. More like "if I had enough money that I no longer had to do anything to support myself, I guess I'll go do something that I think is fun AND helps people". If it turns out that is work, then earning to give will probably be something to look at. If it turns out that that is sitting at home all day watching anime and playing games and reading fiction, then that's what I'd do. (I guess it would be a balance between the two - maybe I'd work on software projects I'd find fun to do when I felt like it - I know I get the itch to build something within a week of vacation)

But I'm not the sort of type to endure personal hardships for others. That sounds mean and it probably is - when I'd work to give I'd basically be in it not to help those people but to hear their stories or to experience a new thing.

Bad example (because westerners going to africa to work is not EA; you'd be better off working in europe and sending the money instead): If I went to Africa to help people there, I wouldn't be doing it to help those people, I would be doing it because it would be interesting to go on a trip like that and meet people like that and see a village and see that "look, I am helping these people isn't that great". And then promptly go back after wintery me has been exposed to the african sun a few times because by gods that is intolerable.

I am more EA-oriented than your average person, but I am not altruistic.

... Then again, some people set the limit of "doing enough" at donating 10% of their income, and if I did that after I became financially independent then you could say that'd be enough already. I don't know.

I don't really have a reply to this, but pet peeve of mine: "wierdness" when you mean "weirdness"

I definitely would pay Omega. Here, I'm just going "that's one shady prophet".