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I'm still completely confused: what happened with the rock?
Recap of Chapter 17 and how Dumbledore manages to act insane while still giving meaningful advice and not lying.
"Why?" Dumbledore repeated. "Ah, Harry, if I went around all day asking why I do things, I'd never have time to get a single thing done! I'm quite a busy person, you know."
Dumbledore means that he doesn't spend all day asking himself 'why am i protecting the magical world' he just goes out and does it. It doesn't mean he just wanders around doing random acts.
"I'm sorry," Harry said. He felt wretched at this point, he'd just told off Gandalf essentially, and Dumbledore's kindness was only making him feel worse. "I shouldn't have distrusted you."
"Alas, Harry, in this world..." The old wizard shook his head. "I cannot even say you were unwise." Since Dumbledore was the one that wrote the note in the first place Harry WAS wise to distrust him. Dumbledore manipulated Harry like a puppet.
"So... why do I have to carry this rock exactly?" "I can't think of a reason, actually," said Dumbledore.
A current theory is that it contains the Philosophers stone, its certainly more important than just a rock. Dumbledore can't think of a reason why he would need it but he is giving it to Harry Just In Case, hence why he can't of a reason why Harry might need it. Its the same reason why Harry carries around a full med-kit. edit: Okay as has been pointed out to me its a pretty poor theory that is almost certainly wrong.
"This," Dumbledore intoned, "was your mother's fifth-year Potions textbook."
"Which I am to carry with me at all times," said Harry.
"Which holds a terrible secret. A secret whose revelation could prove so disastrous that I must ask you to swear - and I do require you to swear it seriously, Harry, whatever you may think of all this - never to tell anyone or anything else.".
This book is proof that Dumbledore intervened to make Lily Evans distrust Snape, who was the friend she is referring to. Snape whose entire existence is based upon his love for Lily had it taken away from him by Dumbledore. Quite a terrible secret indeed, but until you know that you think that Dumbledore just snuck into the girl's dorms to mess with their mind.
Now, we know that Harry's Invisibility Cloak is apparently never detected by the former spell
Refresh my memory: how do we know this?
Actually if I remember correctly during the bully final showdown Hermoine gets scared because she recognizes one of the charms as one that would detect Harry's cloak in the area if not find it directly.
I'm increasingly struck by the foreshadowing EY uses. Instead of pulling things out of his ass, he sets up whatever happens. Unlike the original series, I expect a satisfying ending where all the pieces fit together and make sense.
Along these lines, go back and look at the little chat Quirrell had with Harry after they broke Bella out of Azkaban. To summarize Quirrell: People are hypocritical and delusional pricks who will bleed their grandmothers for a nickel. They care nothing for people accused of crimes, but instead sadistically compete to show strength by abusing them. Being young and naive, you can still tolerate them, but once their idiocy strikes at something dear to you, you'll despise them as I do, and decide it's better to rule them than tolerate the abominations that inevitably follow when you don't.
And what happens? Hermione is accused of a crime, which is transparently improbably, but people compete to sadistically abuse her regardless. Their idiocy strikes at something dear to Harry, and in his heart, he declares war on magical Britain, musing "Dark Lord" just doesn't sound as bad as it used to.
EY and Quirrell couldn't have spelled it out more clearly.
Shouldn't this have occurred to Harry as well? When does he make the connection to that discussion?
It occurs to me, as I state in another thread below, that if Quirrell wasn't looking for a distraction to steal the stone, but really just wanted to make a point to Harry, he has done it. He could easily now save the day with some evidence to exonerate Hermione, and even tell Harry that he did the whole thing just to show Harry who was right in their discussion after the breakout. As a bonus, when Harry finds out that Dumbledore was complicit in Narcissa's murder, covering up for Bones for political purposes, Harry will see that Dumbledore was willing to trade Hermione's torture execution for political gain.
And speaking of making a point, didn't Hat and Cloak tell Hermione that Harry would sacrifice her if he had to? Maybe he'll be able to make two points with one scheme. He'll push Harry away from everyone but Hermione, but Hermoine away from him? Imagine Harry's bitterness and desolation.
That's pretty good.
But maybe the plot fails because Hermione doesn't hate Harry for not saving her, and that's something that Quirrell just can't understand. Hermoine saves the day by thinking of others over herself, and keeping Harry off the Quirrell path. Seems a likely homily form EY.
I recently reread the chapter where Dumbledore gives Harry his rock. Its kind of shocking at how well it was written where the first time you are completely confused and the second time you are like, "Oh dumbledore you magnificent bastard'
Hmm, good point, there are other potential dangers. They are of the type that are pretty much only dangerous if you don't know about them. So if your enemy spikes your water supply, you would be in trouble, but that's not an unintended danger.
I wonder if there any charms to protect or clean up radiation damage . . . . .
A few not particularly relevant concerns. Transfiguration is dangerous in MOR, But the type of danger McGonagall discusses is basically the same as any toxin. It's literally only dangerous if you eat it or breath it. A bubble head charm and enough self control not to eat anything that looks tasty and transfiguration reversion is no danger. So why is Mcgonagall so surprised that Dumbledoor used transfiguration in battle, and is still alive?
That being said, I think transfiguration is second only to time-travel in magics that are dangerous in the hands of creative people. For instance, what about transfiguring antimatter? There's no way Harry didn't think of that. I thought of that when I was near his age and reading canon. Obviously this is incredibly dangerous, but if he wants to level Azkaban, that's the easiest option. There's plenty of other fun things. For instance he could make an ionizing radiation death ray with a chunk of low half life material eg sodium-24 in a lead chamber with a small exit. Set it up as near Malfoy manor as possible and wait a little.
Yeah but antimatter would probably kill the Aurors and the prisoners. Also Harry would probably realize that while subjecting people to dementors is evil, having a prison for people who commit crimes is not.
Stealing a powerful wizard's wand, even if you yourself are invisible, isn't a small feat.
Harry has no way to reach Quirrel on his own. He doesn't even know where Draco or Snape are, and can't reach them either. He also can't bring in another student.
Dumbledore can't help him now (people would notice if he stepped out for a few seconds), so he'd have to rely on him going back in time later to help him - Harry can't manipulate the wands himself, let alone false memory charm someone. This has the usual problems of relying on something already being modified by future travel back in time, without actually observing it.
Harry can't know if Jugson has an alibi for that time.
Fair points, it would be very impressive if he could pull it all off, but I think Dark Harry could manage to do it with some luck.
*For the wand I was thinking of something like pulling it out and then pushing someone into Lord Jugson and dropping it at his feet. He could properly time it so that 1st harry pulls it out and runs then 2cd harry immediately pushes either Jugson or someone into Jugson and drops the wand at his feet. Even if Jugson suspects something what can he prove?
*If Quirrel had returned to the School already Harry would know, if he is still in interrogation it says specifically that Quirrel is in the magical law department, which is in the ministry which is in the Wizengamot. It wouldn't be hard for Harry to know/learn thats where Quirrel was. He would just have to find his way there. Snape is presumably back in Hogwarts as a teacher. He would just have to take the Floo network back to Hogwarts. He doesn't have to take another student he is just has to make sure they show up on time.
*Dumbledore doesn't have to do it, Harry could get Snape or Quirrel to do it. Probably conspicuously absent Quirrel.
*Jugson could easily have an alibi but its hard to prove he didn't just false memory charm the people for the alibi too.
My idea that to the best of my knowledge is my own, is that Harry could use the time turner to go back in time, and get Quirrel/Snape/Dumbledore to false memory charm a student to provide crucial testimony clearing Hermoine and proving a plot. Another part that would help would be to present the wands as evidence (not original to me) but to also steal the wands of Draco and Hermoine out of custody using the cloak and tamper with them to remove any evidence if hat and cloak tampered with them.
I'll expand on this with a post attached to my main one since I've discovered that some people don't like long walls of texts, so if you come up with some reason why this wouldn't work check that post first please.
"The boy smiled, now with a touch of coldness again. "Okay, I'll figure out some way to set it up so that it looks like Lord Jugson betrayed his own side." "
I think that the optimal thing for Harry to do would be to plant fake evidence showing that Lord Jugson was the one whom plotted against Draco. The motivation would be a combination of Lucius 'betraying' the death eaters and a desire to see his house rise in power over House Malfoy. All he would have to do would be to go back in time an hour, steal the wands of Draco, Hermoine and Jugson, and go back in time farther with that done.
Then he just has to get Snape/Quirrel/Dumbledore to false memory charm a student into remembering seeing Lord Jugson leaving or entering the Trophy room at midnight. After that you just tamper with the wands, cast the right spells using Lord Jugson's wand, then sneak back into the Wizengamot and replace the wands a second after you first stole them.
My idea that to the best of my knowledge is my own, is that Harry could use the time turner to go back in time, and get Quirrel/Snape/Dumbledore to false memory charm a student to provide crucial testimony clearing Hermoine and proving a plot. Another part that would help would be to present the wands as evidence (not original to me) but to also steal the wands of Draco and Hermoine out of custody using the cloak and tamper with them to remove any evidence if hat and cloak tampered with them.
I'll expand on this with a post attached to my main one since I've discovered that some people don't like long walls of texts, so if you come up with some reason why this wouldn't work check that post first please.
To respond to Xachariah in my previous post summed up by "Enough people in the wizengamot would know about time travel that would be able to counter any time travel, or recognize it and have safeguards built in against tampering that way" This IS the universe where they don't use dying people to cast unbreakable oath spells, play Quidditch, and are sentencing a 12 year old girl to death in Azkhbahn after a 24 hour investigation (yes yes ten years but that would kill her all the time) If you look at all the possible worlds in regards to policies and safeguards regarding time turners worlds where Harry would be able to get away with this would have much higher probability density.
My idea that to the best of my knowledge is my own, is that Harry could use the time turner to go back in time, and get Quirrel/Snape/Dumbledore to false memory charm a student to provide crucial testimony clearing Hermoine and proving a plot. Another part that would help would be to present the wands as evidence (not original to me) but to also steal the wands of Draco and Hermoine out of custody using the cloak and tamper with them to remove any evidence if hat and cloak tampered with them.
I'll expand on this with a post attached to my main one since I've discovered that some people don't like long walls of texts, so if you come up with some reason why this wouldn't work check that post first please.
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Yes, but Harry's Cloak wasn't anywhere near there, so...
Fully two dozen different Charms must have been spoken, then, but no more invisible people showed up. One of them in particular made Hermione's heart sink; she recognized it as the Charm which had been listed alongside the description of the True Cloak of Invisibility, which would not reveal the Cloak, but would tell you whether it or certain other artifacts were nearby.
To clarify when I said 'actually . . . .' i meant to disprove that assertion not support it.