Comment author: passive_fist 08 January 2015 09:34:14AM 1 point [-]

I guess the major difference would be that dating doesn't give you rapid feedback.

Comment author: Remontoire 08 January 2015 10:28:00AM 1 point [-]

It does if you interpret James's comment to mean interactions with romantic intent.

Dating a single person for a long time is akin to managing a team of developers (sure, you don't get quick feedback) and chatting to someone you don't know in a book store is like quickly compiling something in a new language.

Comment author: simplicio 18 December 2013 11:38:00PM 2 points [-]

Fair enough, heh. But I wouldn't want to idealize the epistemic purity of engineering. Amusingly in this context, often engineering decisions are based more on precedent than science (has somebody else done things this way?), and it sometimes happens that there is a "bottom line" for which evidence is post hoc deduced (e.g., by relaxing the stringency of assumptions in a model in order to get the "right" answer).

Granted, such rationalizations usually affect risks only at the margin, but still...

I guess the bottom line is that engineering is not just science but also aesthetics, economics, and group coordination. To the extent that those things involve cognitive biases et cetera, engineering does too.

Comment author: Remontoire 19 December 2013 10:14:12AM 2 points [-]

I disagree. Unless we are talking about sofware engineering then it seems to me that what you select is based on previous projects but the choices themselves are based on tested scientific models with predictive power.

Comment author: ikacer 17 November 2013 05:46:22PM 1 point [-]

Thanks for the link, that was a very interesting read!

The generation technique reminds me a lot of active recall. In both cases doing some sort of work yourself improves retention.

I imagine it works best with theoretical material, and for many topics it would be near impossible to use. For example, recently I've been studying some nuclear physics, which it is very empirically based. The equations are made to fit the experimental data, and so are difficult to generate.

Seemingly a better way to use the technique would be for the material to be presented with key parts missing, and the learner would have to generate just those parts. This, of course, requires specifically prepared material, and not just the conventional textbooks I am using.

Comment author: Remontoire 18 November 2013 06:12:42AM 1 point [-]

There seems to be a definite relation between active recall, the testing effect, spaced repetition, generation, learning in different environments, changing the parameters of learning. They seem to all work with long term memory by either filling short term memory up with different material or waiting until short term memory forgets the material in question. At least, that's my reading of the research.

I found out about these learning effects while researching the interaction between spaced repetition and deliberate practice. I'm starting to think that certain parts of deliberate practice are wrong. Namely conflating measured improvement in a task directly after training with actual learning (ie how much skill you retain after a couple of days).

I would love to know what long term application of these techniques look like. Are you cumulatively improving faster than if you took a more traditional approach(massing many practice problems in one time frame)?

Comment author: ikacer 11 November 2013 11:48:21AM *  13 points [-]

I have a system for reading difficult textbooks that I find works well. The basic idea behind my method is that the subject matter is easy once you have the right cached thoughts, so use spaced repetition to cache those thoughts before learning the difficult parts.

  1. For the first reading, have a notebook handy. Make a note of all terminology, definitions, etc.. Don't spend too much time trying to understand it all, and don't do any of the exercises or problems. The purpose of this step is to identify any things that will help you understand the material. For example, if a derivation uses a math identity you don't have memorized, make a note of it.

  2. The second step, which I usually do on the next day, is to take each item I noted in my notebook and put it into my spaced repetition software. This has the added benefit of making me reread just the most important concepts in a chapter. After they are in SRS, I'll do go through my SRS study.

  3. The third step, which I usually do on the third day (after doing my SRS reps for the day), is to read the chapter thoroughly. This is where I'll do the exercises and practice problems.

Steps 1 and 3 take the longest, so if I'm working two textbooks, I'll have them offset on days, with textbook A will be on step 2 when textbook B is on step 1, etc.

This may not be fastest way to read, but I find it works well. It takes me about a month to get through a single textbook, which is why I read multiple texts in parallel-- it also takes about a month for me to read three textbooks. The use of SRS also helps with retention of the material after I've finished the text.

Comment author: Remontoire 17 November 2013 12:54:52PM 2 points [-]

It actually sounds like you're getting a third effect out of your setup. Namely interleaving.

http://learninglab.uchicago.edu/Publications_files/5-CogsciIddeas2005.pdf

You could probably improve it slightly further by trying to generate your own theories before reading chapters and learning the material in different locations.

Comment author: Remontoire 05 November 2013 06:26:24PM 0 points [-]

Learning and memorization.

Spaced repetition, the testing effect and the use of mnemonics has not replaced linear non tested study (where you read something over multiple times in a short period of time, don't test yourself and don't space the readings.)