Tulpa References/Discussion
There have been a number of discussions here on LessWrong about "tulpas", but it's been scattered about with no central thread for the discussion. So I thought I would put this up here, along with a centralized list of reliable information sources, just so we all stay on the same page.
Tulpas are deliberately created "imaginary friends" which in many ways resemble separate, autonomous minds. Often, the creation of a tulpa is coupled with deliberately induced visual, auditory, and/or tactile hallucinations of the being.
Previous discussions here on LessWrong: 1 2 3
Questions that have been raised:
1. How do tulpas work?
2. Are tulpas safe, from a mental health perspective?
3. Are tulpas conscious? (may be a hard question)
4. More generally, is making a tulpa a good idea? What are they useful for?
Pertinent Links and Publications
(I will try to keep this updated if/when further sources are found)
- In this article1, the psychological anthropologist Tanya M. Luhrmann connects tulpas to the "voice of God" experienced by devout evangelicals - a phenomenon more thoroughly discussed in her book When God Talks Back: Understanding the American Evangelical Relationship with God. Luhrmann has also succeeded2 in inducing tulpa-like visions of Leland Stanford, jr. in experimental subjects.
- This paper3 investigates the phenomenon of authors who experience their characters as "real", which may be tulpas by yet another name.
- There is an active subreddit of people who have or are developing tulpas, with an FAQ, links to creation guides, etc.
- tulpa.info is a valuable resource, particularly the forum. There appears to be a whole "research" section for amateur experiments and surveys.
- This particular experiment suggests that the idea of using tulpas to solve problems faster is a no-go.
- Also, one person helpfully hooked themselves up to an EEG and then performed various mental activities related to their tulpa.
- Another possibly related phenomenon is the way that actors immerse themselves in their characters. See especially the section on "Masks" in Keith Johnstone's book Impro: Improvisation and the Theatre (related quotations and video)4.
- This blogger has some interesting ideas about the neurological basis of tulpas, based on Julian Jaynes's The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind, a book whose scientific validity is not clear to me.
- It is not hard to find new age mystical books about the use of "thoughtforms", or the art of "channeling" "spirits", often clearly talking about the same phenomenon. These books are likely to be low in useful information for our purposes, however. Therefore I'm not going to list the ones I've found here, as they would clutter up the list significantly.
- (Updated 2/9/2015) The abstract of a paper by our very own Kaj Sotala hypothesizing about the mechanisms behind tulpa creation.5
(Bear in mind while perusing these resources that if you have serious qualms about creating a tulpa, it might not be a good idea to read creation guides too carefully; making a tulpa is easy to do and, at least for me, was hard to resist. Proceed at your own risk.)
Footnotes
1. "Conjuring Up Our Own Gods", a 14 October 2013 New York Times Op-Ed
2. "Hearing the Voice of God" by Jill Wolfson in the July/August 2013 Stanford Alumni Magazine
3. "The Illusion of Independent Agency: Do Adult Fiction Writers Experience Their Characters as Having Minds of Their Own?"; Taylor, Hodges & Kohànyi in Imagination, Cognition and Personality; 2002/2003; 22, 4
4. Thanks to pure_awesome
5. "Sentient companions predicted and modeled into existence: explaining the tulpa phenomenon" by Kaj Sotala
Absolute denial for atheists
This article is a deliberate meta-troll. To be successful I need your trolling cooperation. Now hear me out.
In The Strangest Thing An AI Could Tell You Eliezer talks about asognostics, who have one of their arm paralyzed, and what's most interesting are in absolute denial of this - in spite of overwhelming evidence that their arm is paralyzed they will just come with new and new rationalizations proving it's not.
Doesn't it sound like someone else we know? Yes, religious people! In spite of heaps of empirical evidence against existence of their particular flavour of the supernatural, internal inconsistency of their beliefs, and perfectly plausible alternative explanations being well known, something between 90% and 98% of humans believe in the supernatural world, and is in a state of absolute denial not too dissimilar to one of asognostics. Perhaps as many as billions of people in history have even been willing to die for their absurd beliefs.
We are mostly atheists here - we happen not to share this particular delusion. But please consider an outside view for a moment - how likely is it that unlike almost everyone else we don't have any other such delusions, for which we're in absolute denial of truth in spite of mounting heaps of evidence?
If the delusion is of the kind that all of us share it, we won't be able to find it without building an AI. We might have some of those - it's not too unlikely as we're a small and self-selected group.
What I want you to do is try to trigger absolute denial macro in your fellow rationalists! Is there anything that you consider proven beyond any possibility of doubt by both empirical evidence and pure logic, and yet saying it triggers automatic stream of rationalizations in other people? Yes, I pretty much ask you to troll, but it's a good kind of trolling, and I cannot think of any other way to find our delusions.
The Unfriendly Superintelligence next door
Markets are powerful decentralized optimization engines - it is known. Liberals see the free market as a kind of optimizer run amuck, a dangerous superintelligence with simple non-human values that must be checked and constrained by the government - the friendly SI. Conservatives just reverse the narrative roles.
In some domains, where the incentive structure aligns with human values, the market works well. In our current framework, the market works best for producing gadgets. It does not work so well for pricing intangible information, and most specifically it is broken when it comes to health.

We treat health as just another gadget problem: something to be solved by pills. Health is really a problem of knowledge; it is a computational prediction problem. Drugs are useful only to the extent that you can package the results of new knowledge into a pill and patent it. If you can't patent it, you can't profit from it.
So the market is constrained to solve human health by coming up with new patentable designs for mass-producible physical objects which go into human bodies. Why did we add that constraint - thou should solve health, but thou shalt only use pills? (Ok technically the solutions don't have to be ingestible, but that's a detail.)
The gadget model works for gadgets because we know how gadgets work - we built them, after all. The central problem with health is that we do not completely understand how the human body works - we did not build it. Thus we should be using the market to figure out how the body works - completely - and arguably we should be allocating trillions of dollars towards that problem.
The market optimizer analogy runs deeper when we consider the complexity of instilling values into a market. Lawmakers cannot program the market with goals directly, so instead they attempt to engineer desireable behavior by ever more layers and layers of constraints. Lawmakers are deontologists.
As an example, consider the regulations on drug advertising. Big pharma is unsafe - its profit function does not encode anything like "maximize human health and happiness" (which of course itself is an oversimplification). If allowed to its own devices, there are strong incentives to sell subtly addictive drugs, to create elaborate hyped false advertising campaigns, etc. Thus all the deontological injunctions. I take that as a strong indicator of a poor solution - a value alignment failure.
What would healthcare look like in a world where we solved the alignment problem?
To solve the alignment problem, the market's profit function must encode long term human health and happiness. This really is a mechanism design problem - its not something lawmakers are even remotely trained or qualified for. A full solution is naturally beyond the scope of a little blog post, but I will sketch out the general idea.
To encode health into a market utility function, first we create financial contracts with an expected value which captures long-term health. We can accomplish this with a long-term contract that generates positive cash flow when a human is healthy, and negative when unhealthy - basically an insurance contract. There is naturally much complexity in getting those contracts right, so that they measure what we really want. But assuming that is accomplished, the next step is pretty simple - we allow those contracts to trade freely on an open market.
There are some interesting failure modes and considerations that are mostly beyond scope but worth briefly mentioning. This system probably needs to be asymmetric. The transfers on poor health outcomes should partially go to cover medical payments, but it may be best to have a portion of the wealth simply go to nobody/everybody - just destroyed.
In this new framework, designing and patenting new drugs can still be profitable, but it is now put on even footing with preventive medicine. More importantly, the market can now actually allocate the correct resources towards long term research.
To make all this concrete, let's use an example of a trillion dollar health question - one that our current system is especially ill-posed to solve:
What are the long-term health effects of abnormally low levels of solar radiation? What levels of sun exposure are ideal for human health?
This is a big important question, and you've probably read some of the hoopla and debate about vitamin D. I'm going to soon briefly summarize a general abstract theory, one that I would bet heavily on if we lived in a more rational world where such bets were possible.
In a sane world where health is solved by a proper computational market, I could make enormous - ridiculous really - amounts of money if I happened to be an early researcher who discovered the full health effects of sunlight. I would bet on my theory simply by buying up contracts for individuals/demographics who had the most health to gain by correcting their sunlight deficiency. I would then publicize the theory and evidence, and perhaps even raise a heap pile of money to create a strong marketing engine to help ensure that my investments - my patients - were taking the necessary actions to correct their sunlight deficiency. Naturally I would use complex machine learning models to guide the trading strategy.
Now, just as an example, here is the brief 'pitch' for sunlight.

If we go back and look across all of time, there is a mountain of evidence which more or less screams - proper sunlight is important to health. Heliotherapy has a long history.
Humans, like most mammals, and most other earth organisms in general, evolved under the sun. A priori we should expect that organisms will have some 'genetic programs' which take approximate measures of incident sunlight as an input. The serotonin -> melatonin mediated blue-light pathway is an example of one such light detecting circuit which is useful for regulating the 24 hour circadian rhythm.
The vitamin D pathway has existed since the time of algae such as the Coccolithophore. It is a multi-stage pathway that can measure solar radiation over a range of temporal frequencies. It starts with synthesis of fat soluble cholecalciferiol which has a very long half life measured in months. [1] [2]
- Cholecalciferiol (HL ~ months) becomes
- 25(OH)D (HL ~ 15 days) which finally becomes
- 1,25(OH)2 D (HL ~ 15 hours)
The main recognized role for this pathway in regards to human health - at least according to the current Wikipedia entry - is to enhance "the internal absorption of calcium, iron, magnesium, phosphate, and zinc". Ponder that for a moment.
Interestingly, this pathway still works as a general solar clock and radiation detector for carnivores - as they can simply eat the precomputed measurement in their diet.
So, what is a long term sunlight detector useful for? One potential application could be deciding appropriate resource allocation towards DNA repair. Every time an organism is in the sun it is accumulating potentially catastrophic DNA damage that must be repaired when the cell next divides. We should expect that genetic programs would allocate resources to DNA repair and various related activities dependent upon estimates of solar radiation.
I should point out - just in case it isn't obvious - that this general idea does not imply that cranking up the sunlight hormone to insane levels will lead to much better DNA/cellular repair. There are always tradeoffs, etc.
One other obvious use of a long term sunlight detector is to regulate general strategic metabolic decisions that depend on the seasonal clock - especially for organisms living far from the equator. During the summer when food is plentiful, the body can expect easy calories. As winter approaches calories become scarce and frugal strategies are expected.
So first off we'd expect to see a huge range of complex effects showing up as correlations between low vit D levels and various illnesses, and specifically illnesses connected to DNA damage (such as cancer) and or BMI.
Now it turns out that BMI itself is also strongly correlated with a huge range of health issues. So the first key question to focus on is the relationship between vit D and BMI. And - perhaps not surprisingly - there is pretty good evidence for such a correlation [3][4] , and this has been known for a while.
Now we get into the real debate. Numerous vit D supplement intervention studies have now been run, and the results are controversial. In general the vit D experts (such as my father, who started the vit D council, and publishes some related research[5]) say that the only studies that matter are those that supplement at high doses sufficient to elevate vit D levels into a 'proper' range which substitutes for sunlight, which in general requires 5000 IU day on average - depending completely on genetics and lifestyle (to the point that any one-size-fits all recommendation is probably terrible).
The mainstream basically ignores all that and funds studies at tiny RDA doses - say 400 IU or less - and then they do meta-analysis over those studies and conclude that their big meta-analysis, unsurprisingly, doesn't show a statistically significant effect. However, these studies still show small effects. Often the meta-analysis is corrected for BMI, which of course also tends to remove any vit D effect, to the extent that low vit D/sunlight is a cause of both weight gain and a bunch of other stuff.
So let's look at two studies for vit D and weight loss.
First, this recent 2015 study of 400 overweight Italians (sorry the actual paper doesn't appear to be available yet) tested vit D supplementation for weight loss. The 3 groups were (0 IU/day, ~1,000 IU / day, ~3,000 IU/day). The observed average weight loss was (1 kg, 3.8 kg, 5.4 kg). I don't know if the 0 IU group received a placebo. Regardless, it looks promising.
On the other hand, this 2013 meta-analysis of 9 studies with 1651 adults total (mainly women) supposedly found no significant weight loss effect for vit D. However, the studies used between 200 IU/day to 1,100 IU/day, with most between 200 to 400 IU. Five studies used calcium, five also showed weight loss (not necessarily the same - unclear). This does not show - at all - what the study claims in its abstract.
In general, medical researchers should not be doing statistics. That is a job for the tech industry.
Now the vit D and sunlight issue is complex, and it will take much research to really work out all of what is going on. The current medical system does not appear to be handling this well - why? Because there is insufficient financial motivation.
Is Big Pharma interested in the sunlight/vit D question? Well yes - but only to the extent that they can create a patentable analogue! The various vit D analogue drugs developed or in development is evidence that Big Pharma is at least paying attention. But assuming that the sunlight hypothesis is mainly correct, there is very little profit in actually fixing the real problem.
There is probably more to sunlight that just vit D and serotonin/melatonin. Consider the interesting correlation between birth month and a number of disease conditions[6]. Perhaps there is a little grain of truth to astrology after all.
Thus concludes my little vit D pitch.
In a more sane world I would have already bet on the general theory. In a really sane world it would have been solved well before I would expect to make any profitable trade. In that rational world you could actually trust health advertising, because you'd know that health advertisers are strongly financially motivated to convince you of things actually truly important for your health.
Instead of charging by the hour or per treatment, like a mechanic, doctors and healthcare companies should literally invest in their patients long-term health, and profit from improvements to long term outcomes. The sunlight health connection is a trillion dollar question in terms of medical value, but not in terms of exploitable profits in today's reality. In a properly constructed market, there would be enormous resources allocated to answer these questions, flowing into legions of profit motivated startups that could generate billions trading on computational health financial markets, all without selling any gadgets.
So in conclusion: the market could solve health, but only if we allowed it to and only if we setup appropriate financial mechanisms to encode the correct value function. This is the UFAI problem next door.
The Other Path - a poem
Inspired by the call to rationalist poetry fans and informed by years of writing satire.
When you ask for truth and are offered illusion,
When senses deceive you and reasoning lies
I'll show you the path through the murky confusion,
Just follow and close your eyes.
On matters of fact there's no fact of the matter,
All moral and virtue are fashion and fad,
So dress in the creed that will fit you and flatter
No one can argue with that.
Some puzzles unyielding and mysteries ancient
No formula ever could hope to describe.
How proudly the scientist seeks explanations
How clearly in vain she strives.
Make cases like fortifications of metal,
No rival assertion shall ever go past.
Be carefree in choosing the side of the battle
But guard it until your last.
The sages declared that to know is to suffer,
Where wisdom is gained there is innocence lost
And learning is danger – best leave it to others,
Avoid it at any cost.
Some fools declare war on their very own nature
Their weapons are evidence, reason and math.
Don't offer compassion to those wretched creatures,
They've chosen the other path.
Unemployment explanations
When I knew nothing of economics, unemployment wasn't mysterious. People wanted a job, and couldn't get one - well, people often want stuff they can't get. Nothing strange there, just one of those things.
Then I learnt some simple economics, and it became more mysterious. The employment market is a market, with the salary being the price. Why doesn't this market clear? Why doesn't the price (salary) simply adjust, and then everyone gets a job? It seemed profoundly mysterious that this didn't happen.
I've been gradually introducing myself to more economics (mostly indirectly) and I've encountered a lot of explanations for this perpetual market failure. Thus the mystery of unemployment is, if not resolved, at least somewhat explained. Since I would really have enjoyed reading a collection of unemployment explanations when I was initially puzzled (almost any explanation of unemployment you read in the press is worthless) I thought I'd do this for others. So here is my (entirely personal and idiosyncratic) summary of the main explanations I've encountered.
Bayesianism for humans: "probable enough"
There are two insights from Bayesianism which occurred to me and which I hadn't seen anywhere else before.
I like lists in the two posts linked above, so for the sake of completeness, I'm going to add my two cents to a public domain. Second penny is here.
Bayesianism for Humans
Recently, I completed my first systematic read-through of the sequences. One of the biggest effects this had on me was considerably warming my attitude towards Bayesianism. Not long ago, if you'd asked me my opinion of Bayesianism, I'd probably have said something like, "Bayes' theorem is all well and good when you know what numbers to plug in, but all too often you don't."
Now I realize that that objection is based on a misunderstanding of Bayesianism, or at least Bayesianism-as-advocated-by-Eliezer-Yudkowsky. "When (Not) To Use Probabilities" is all about this issue, but a cleaner expression of Eliezer's true view may be this quote from "Beautiful Probability":
No, you can't always do the exact Bayesian calculation for a problem. Sometimes you must seek an approximation; often, indeed. This doesn't mean that probability theory has ceased to apply, any more than your inability to calculate the aerodynamics of a 747 on an atom-by-atom basis implies that the 747 is not made out of atoms. Whatever approximation you use, it works to the extent that it approximates the ideal Bayesian calculation - and fails to the extent that it departs.
The practical upshot of seeing Bayesianism as an ideal to be approximated, I think, is this: you should avoid engaging in any reasoning that's demonstrably nonsensical in Bayesian terms. Furthermore, Bayesian reasoning can be fruitfully mined for heuristics that are useful in the real world. That's an idea that actually has real-world applications for human beings, hence the title of this post, "Bayesianism for Humans."
Roles are Martial Arts for Agency
A long time ago I thought that Martial Arts simply taught you how to fight – the right way to throw a punch, the best technique for blocking and countering an attack, etc. I thought training consisted of recognizing these attacks and choosing the correct responses more quickly, as well as simply faster/stronger physical execution of same. It was later that I learned that the entire purpose of martial arts is to train your body to react with minimal conscious deliberation, to remove “you” from the equation as much as possible.
The reason is of course that conscious thought is too slow. If you have to think about what you’re doing, you’ve already lost. It’s been said that if you had to think about walking to do it, you’d never make it across the room. Fighting is no different. (It isn’t just fighting either – anything that requires quick reaction suffers when exposed to conscious thought. I used to love Rock Band. One day when playing a particularly difficult guitar solo on expert I nailed 100%… except “I” didn’t do it at all. My eyes saw the notes, my hands executed them, and no where was I involved in the process. It was both exhilarating and creepy, and I basically dropped the game soon after.)
You’ve seen how long it takes a human to learn to walk effortlessly. That's a situation with a single constant force, an unmoving surface, no agents working against you, and minimal emotional agitation. No wonder it takes hundreds of hours, repeating the same basic movements over and over again, to attain even a basic level of martial mastery. To make your body react correctly without any thinking involved. When Neo says “I Know Kung Fu” he isn’t surprised that he now has knowledge he didn’t have before. He’s amazed that his body now reacts in the optimal manner when attacked without his involvement.
All of this is simply focusing on pure reaction time – it doesn’t even take into account the emotional terror of another human seeking to do violence to you. It doesn’t capture the indecision of how to respond, the paralysis of having to choose between outcomes which are all awful and you don’t know which will be worse, and the surge of hormones. The training of your body to respond without your involvement bypasses all of those obstacles as well.
This is the true strength of Martial Arts – eliminating your slow, conscious deliberation and acting while there is still time to do so.
Roles are the Martial Arts of Agency.
When one is well-trained in a certain Role, one defaults to certain prescribed actions immediately and confidently. I’ve acted as a guy standing around watching people faint in an overcrowded room, and I’ve acted as the guy telling people to clear the area. The difference was in one I had the role of Corporate Pleb, and the other I had the role of Guy Responsible For This Shit. You know the difference between the guy at the bar who breaks up a fight, and the guy who stands back and watches it happen? The former thinks of himself as the guy who stops fights. They could even be the same guy, on different nights. The role itself creates the actions, and it creates them as an immediate reflex. By the time corporate-me is done thinking “Huh, what’s this? Oh, this looks bad. Someone fainted? Wow, never seen that before. Damn, hope they’re OK. I should call 911.” enforcer-me has already yelled for the room to clear and whipped out a phone.
Roles are the difference between Hufflepuffs gawking when Neville tumbles off his broom (Protected), and Harry screaming “Wingardium Leviosa” (Protector). Draco insulted them afterwards, but it wasn’t a fair insult – they never had the slightest chance to react in time, given the role they were in. Roles are the difference between Minerva ordering Hagrid to stay with the children while she forms troll-hunting parties (Protector), and Harry standing around doing nothing while time slowly ticks away (Protected). Eventually he switched roles. But it took Agency to do so. It took time.
Agency is awesome. Half this site is devoted to becoming better at Agency. But Agency is slow. Roles allow real-time action under stress.
Agency has a place of course. Agency is what causes us to decide that Martial Arts training is important, that has us choose a Martial Art, and then continue to train month after month. Agency is what lets us decide which Roles we want to play, and practice the psychology and execution of those roles. But when the time for action is at hand, Agency is too slow. Ensure that you have trained enough for the next challenge, because it is the training that will see you through it, not your agenty conscious thinking.
As an aside, most major failures I’ve seen recently are when everyone assumed that someone else had the role of Guy In Charge If Shit Goes Down. I suggest that, in any gathering of rationalists, they begin the meeting by choosing one person to be Dictator In Extremis should something break. Doesn’t have to be the same person as whoever is leading. Would be best if it was someone comfortable in the role and/or with experience in it. But really there just needs to be one. Anyone.
cross-posted from my blog
Support That Sounds Like Dissent
Related to: Why Our Kind Can't Cooperate
Eliezer described a scene that's familiar to all of us:
Imagine that you're at a conference, and the speaker gives a 30-minute talk. Afterward, people line up at the microphones for questions. The first questioner objects to the graph used in slide 14 using a logarithmic scale; he quotes Tufte on The Visual Display of Quantitative Information. The second questioner disputes a claim made in slide 3. The third questioner suggests an alternative hypothesis that seems to explain the same data...
An outsider might conclude that this presentation went poorly, because all of the people who spoke afterwards seemed to disagree. Someone who had been to a few conferences would understand that this is normal; only the people who disagree speak up, while the the rest stay silent, because taking the mic to say "me too!" isn't a productive use of everyone's time. If you polled the audience, you might expect to find a few vocal dissenters against a silent majority. This is not what you would find.
Consider this situation more closely. A series of people step up, and say things which sound like disagreement. But do they really disagree? The first questioner is only quibbling with a bit of the presentation; he hasn't actually disagreed with the main point. The second questioner has challenged one of the claims from the presentation, but ignored the rest. The third questioner has proposed an alternative hypothesis which might be true, but that doesn't mean the alternative hypothesis is true, or even that the questioner thinks it's likely. If you stopped and asked these questioners whether they agreed with the main thrust of the presentation, they would probably say that they do. Why, then, does it sound like everyone disagrees?
Confound it! Correlation is (usually) not causation! But why not?
It is widely understood that statistical correlation between two variables ≠ causation. But despite this admonition, people are routinely overconfident in claiming correlations to support particular causal interpretations and are surprised by the results of randomized experiments, suggesting that they are biased & systematically underestimating the prevalence of confounds/common-causation. I speculate that in realistic causal networks or DAGs, the number of possible correlations grows faster than the number of possible causal relationships. So confounds really are that common, and since people do not think in DAGs, the imbalance also explains overconfidence.
Full article: http://www.gwern.net/Causality
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