Comment author: PhilGoetz 22 October 2011 06:20:30PM *  8 points [-]

Don't worry about why you like a terminal value. Just get it.

So, I should acquire additional terminal values so I can have higher absolute utility?

That's either wisdom or absurdity. It goes against my current model of rationality. But it seems to lead to winning, at least from the starting condition of having no values at all and thus not even being able to win or lose.

I guess it shouldn't be surprising that asking a question whose answer mystifies me leads to other questions that also mystify me. Maybe identifying a set of equivalent mysterious problems would be an advance.

Comment author: analyticsophy 24 October 2011 07:07:54PM -2 points [-]

As long as my average expected utility over all choices available goes up, I'm down to get more goals, and even loose old ones. But if my average expected utility goes down, then screw getting a new value. Though in general, adding a new value does not imply getting rid of an old one; as long as you keep all your old values there is no danger in adding a new one.

Comment author: potato 15 June 2011 09:42:42PM *  2 points [-]

What I'm really asking is, if some statement turns out to be undecidable for all of our Tarskian truth translation maps to models, does that make that conjecture meaningless, or is undecidable somehow distinct from unverifiable. What is the difference between believing "that conjecture is unverifiable" and believing "that conjecture is undecidable."? Are the expectations/restrictions on experience that those two believes offer identical? If so does that mean that the difference between those two believes is a syntactic issue?

See Making Beliefs Pay Rent :

http://lesswrong.com/lw/i3/making_beliefs_pay_rent_in_anticipated_experiences/

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 10:32:45PM -2 points [-]

"1+1=giraffe" is meaningless "Godel sentence" is undecidable

Comment author: RichardKennaway 15 June 2011 08:09:30AM 5 points [-]

It's not that it's too many words for a discussion post. There is no particular word limit. It's too many words, and too overwrought, for what it's saying, which is simply the often-made point that overreaction to child abuse scares can itself be damaging; along with staring hard enough at something in plain sight that it vanishes, as in the adjacent thread on the meaning of life.

How did you arrive at LessWrong, and why did you choose to write this as your first posting here?

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 11:35:14AM 0 points [-]

"There is no particular word limit. It's too many words, and too overwrought, for what it's saying, which is simply the often-made point that overreaction to child abuse scares can itself be damaging." Sorry sir, but if you had simply read my introduction a bit more carefully you might have noticed that from the very beginning I make it clear that my aim is to give an example of how completely un-beneficial moral judgements can enter our culture and become rooted if they hide in our taboo box.

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 07:52:44AM 0 points [-]

Yes, absolutely would. The only thing i think i would loose in doing so is showing that there is much more to our distaste of pedophiles than the obvious harms they cause.

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 08:10:34AM 2 points [-]

Wait I misunderstood what you were asking, sorry. No, I specifically argue that sex involving a non-consenting partner is always going to be traumatic for that member of the ordeal.

Comment author: drethelin 15 June 2011 07:40:42AM 5 points [-]

I can't quote a study but I would bet sure stigmatizing racism directly led to a reduction in racist remarks and actions. People are impressionable and are strongly influenced by the society around them.

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 08:05:45AM -2 points [-]

I don't disagree, but i think the situation becomes drastically different when we are talking about sexual desires. Again, I don't have anything better than moderate familiarization with Kinsey to back that up.

Comment author: fubarobfusco 15 June 2011 07:29:44AM 1 point [-]

Does stigmatizing harmful social acts reliably lead to a reduction in their incidence or in the harm they cause?

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 08:03:49AM -3 points [-]

I would say quite the opposite, as would Dr. Kinsey from what i understand.

Comment author: drethelin 15 June 2011 05:11:25AM *  12 points [-]

The rule : "Do not have sex with children", is not made into a bad rule by the possibility of a child having sex with an adult and not being traumatized, in the same way that the rule : "do not lash people with a whip" is invalidated by the existence of masochistic people.

There were times when a nobleman forcefully taking a peasant woman was not stigmatized and Indeed, if the noble offered, she might even "consent", due to her poor position in life, and the chance at making it better. Yet I do not think this is a state of affairs we would prefer to exist today. There were times when a father was the one person who decided who his child would have sex with, and when, and this was seen as the norm, as right and proper, and yet I'm sure it lead to many an unhappy marriage.

The pedophilia problem is not just one-pronged. The persecution of pedophilia is not the main and only cause of it being bad. Sexual relations between people with drastic power imbalances are rife with opportunities for abuse or coercion. This is not something we want to proliferate, even if there is a chance it can go just fine. We stigmatize pedophilia for the same reason we think it's wrong for bosses to have sex with their employees or doctors to do their patients.

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 08:03:01AM -4 points [-]

My claim is not that "Don't have sex with children." is a bad rule because some children like sex, my claim is that it is primarily the continued enforcement of that rule which causes that rule to be useful at all. Unlike in the case with the king and peasant wife. The peasant's wife really doesn't want to engage in sex with the king but she realizes it might be better off for her because of the way things are ran. The situation I presented is one in which the child is not forced into anything, child rape should be legalized for the same reasons as all other forms, but if the child has no serious opposition to touching a genital, then i don't see why we should morally judge it.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 15 June 2011 05:41:46AM *  7 points [-]

Would you generalize your analysis of pedophilia to non-consensual sex? If not, why not?

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 07:52:44AM 0 points [-]

Yes, absolutely would. The only thing i think i would loose in doing so is showing that there is much more to our distaste of pedophiles than the obvious harms they cause.

Comment author: RichardKennaway 15 June 2011 07:24:42AM 1 point [-]

Too many words.

And its author is no longer a member and has posted nothing else to LessWrong.

I think this is a troll.

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 07:51:27AM 1 point [-]

Also, I don't understand why it say's my page does not exist. I might just try again.

Comment author: Wei_Dai 15 June 2011 05:29:44AM 0 points [-]

Sometimes the memes convince us to adopt them by being beneficial

What does this mean, when the criteria by which we judge what is "beneficial" can also be considered a product of meme/gene co-evolution?

Comment author: analyticsophy 15 June 2011 07:50:54AM 1 point [-]

It means precisely that it works well with what we already consider to be beneficial thanks to our genetic and memetic predispositions.

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