In response to Which College Major?
Comment author: jswan 06 February 2012 03:42:45AM 8 points [-]

I have a BA and MA in English from a top US university, and more than half my lifetime later I'd recommend against it unless you are really sure you want to teach it. As an undergrad I thought I wanted to teach English, but I disliked the graduate studies in the field and I didn't much like teaching at the junior college level when I tried it. Being able to write well has been an enormous help in my alternate career, but you can get that in any course of study that forces you to write frequently under direct criticism. If I had it to do over again I'd do some combination of HPS and CS with a smattering of economics; right up your alley. UBC has a good CS department for sure.

Comment author: Swimmer963 24 January 2012 03:03:00AM *  6 points [-]

Thank you!

The reactions I get from people when I tell them I'm in nursing tend to be either very negative or very positive. The negative ones, most often from my parents' friends who knew me growing up, are "you're a smart girl, why would you want to do that?", at which point my usual defensive retort is, "So? Do you really want a dumb nurse looking after you?"

But an awful lot of people, probably more than 50%, start gushing about how much they respect me for it. As far as I can tell, being in a fancy hard degree like biomed will get you respect for brains, but studying nursing gets you points for character. People know that it's a hard job, not hard in the sense of "only a a few really bright or talented people can do it", but tough physically and emotionally. At work, I tell old ladies who come to aquafit classes that I'm in nursing, and they automatically think I'm a good person...

Comment author: jswan 24 January 2012 04:33:24AM *  2 points [-]

I had no idea when I wrote that that the talk I was going to tonight would be closely related to this topic. It was a talk about the 20th century polymath Michael Polyani (physician, physicist, economist, philosopher), given by a former surgeon and teacher of surgery who's made a late-in-life career change into teaching writing. One of the things he touched on, and which deserves a lot more thought on my part, is the relationship between reductionism and heuristics in critical decision making.

A good chunk of medicine (and I think many, but not all, aspects of nursing in particular) is about decision-making under conditions of limited information. The speaker observed that doctors coming into surgery from a hard science background tended to be less good at it, because their versions of reductionism led them into continuous loops of information gathering, trying to find more and more grains of detail. Doctors who were able to reductively eliminate information in order to converge on decisions were more talented. I asked him how this related to the current developments in medicine with respect to machine learning, robotic surgery, "AI"-driven imaging, etc. He said he didn't have any good answers, but if he were starting his medical career again, that's where he'd want to be.

So first, I think that the kind of intelligence required to make good decisions in an information-restricted environment is maybe not as immediately glamorous as the kind that makes the cover of Nature, but it's just as important. Second, the ways in which different areas of knowledge are converging in medicine makes it a pretty exciting place to be for someone with your interests, and you've got a lot of time to explore them.

Edited to add: I suppose I should note that almost all the nurses I know are or were ER, flight, or ICU nurses, which colors my views.

Comment author: Swimmer963 22 January 2012 03:08:59PM 6 points [-]

As far as it goes, you're absolutely right. I think that's one of the good lessons that my dad taught me, with his self-help books...it matters more (in terms of happiness, and of being good at what you do) that you like what you do all day, as opposed to enjoying the reputation of what you are.

The problem is, I think I would enjoy the day-to-day work of a doctor more than that of a nurse-there's more thinking involved, more theory, and that's always been the part I liked. I would almost certainly enjoy the schooling more than nursing school, too–I can't pretend I'm not bored and underchallenged in the academic aspects of nursing. And my mother is almost certainly right that I would like many aspects of academia–the thinking and researching and studying, if not the competitive atmosphere. I used to read physics and biology books for fun, something I can never claim to have done for nursing textbooks.

Side note:

I am passionate about psychiatry and plan to be an awesome psychiatrist. I am not quite as passionate about organic medicine with its heart attacks and kidney infections, and although I work hard at it and am pretty good, some of my classmates who get up every morning super excited because they've dreamed of treating kidney infections their whole lives are better.

I was pretty meh about my psychiatry placement this fall. The theory is pretty fascinating, and I had some surreal conversations with patients, but in general the nurses don't have a lot to do with theory-basically we just gave out meds, wrote notes in the chart, and then had lots of down time. I loved med-surg partly because of the lack of downtime, which didn't give me a chance to get bored.

Comment author: jswan 24 January 2012 01:26:42AM 0 points [-]

I've known at least one person (and possibly more, it's hard to remember...) who went for a MD after years as a nurse, a couple who went on to nurse-practitioner or PA, and one or two who have shuffled between RN and EMT-P positions as pay and adventure dictate. If you spend some years as a nurse and decide later that you want more schooling, you'll be experienced regarding the options available and probably in a more financially stable position. If you continue to yearn for academia, there are a both teaching and research avenues out there in the nursing and nurse-practitioner fields.

Comment author: jswan 24 January 2012 12:39:06AM 10 points [-]

Before I get bogged down in reading all the comments, I just want to say: nursing is one of the most admirable and versatile professions in existence. There are very few people I'd rather have available in any generic critical situation than an experienced and competent nurse. Good on you.

Comment author: ciphergoth 21 January 2012 09:47:50AM 6 points [-]

Another potential negative is a reduced capacity for strategic self-deception.

Comment author: jswan 21 January 2012 07:34:37PM 2 points [-]

It seems like I can engage in strategic self-deception while acknowledging it as such in order to reduce negative thoughts or tolerate unpleasantness in situations where it's beneficial. Rationality practice seems to be a benefit inasmuch as it allows me to understand better situations in which self-deception leads to negative vs positive outcomes.

Comment author: wedrifid 21 January 2012 03:39:21AM 1 point [-]

When you say stuff like:

"As an autodidact who now consumes whole fields of knowledge in mere weeks, I've developed efficient habits that allow me to research topics quickly."

http://lesswrong.com/lw/5me/scholarship_how_to_do_it_efficiently/

You sound like Tim Ferriss and you make me want to ignore you in the same way I ignore him.

It sounds like you place high importance on public image. In particular, on maintaining a public image that is self effacing or humble. I wonder if, over all, it is more effective for luke to convey confidence and be up front about his achievements and capabilities and so gain influence with a wide range of people or if it is best to optimize his image for that group of people who place high importance on humble decorum.

I don't want to do this because you seem like a good person with a genuine ability to help others. Don't lose that.

Tim Ferris is a good person (as far as people go) and he has been able to positively influence far more people by mastering self promotion than he ever would have been if he restrained himself. Is this about "being a good person and helping others" or keeping your approval? The two seem to be conflated here.

Fortunately for you when luke says "try to be a Rationality Tim Ferris" he does not mean anything at all along the lines of "talk like Tim Ferris". He is talking about being as productive, efficient and resourceful as Tim Ferris. He's talking about Tim's strong capability for instrumental rationality not his even stronger capability for self promotion.

(Incidentally I don't think Tim would make the kind of boast that Luke made there, simply because it is an awkward and poorly implemented boast. Tim boasts by giving a specific example of the awesome thing he has done rather than just making abstract assertions. At least give Tim the credit of knowing how to implement arrogance and boasting somewhat effectively!)

Comment author: jswan 21 January 2012 04:55:28AM *  0 points [-]

Yeah, I think you pretty much called it. It doesn't really work for me, but I guess that if such a communication style is the most effective way to go, drive on.

Comment author: lukeprog 19 January 2012 01:40:36AM 10 points [-]

I like the second option better, too.

I'm certainly going to try to be a Rationality Tim Ferris, but I have a ways to go.

Eliezer is still hampered by the cognitive exhaustion problem that he described way back in 2000. He's tried dozens of things and still tries new diets, sleeping patterns, etc. but we haven't kicked it yet. That said, he's pretty damn productive each day before cognitive exhaustion sets in.

Comment author: jswan 21 January 2012 02:49:18AM *  5 points [-]

I'm certainly going to try to be a Rationality Tim Ferris, but I have a ways to go.

Please no. Here's an example. When you say stuff like:

"As an autodidact who now consumes whole fields of knowledge in mere weeks, I've developed efficient habits that allow me to research topics quickly."

http://lesswrong.com/lw/5me/scholarship_how_to_do_it_efficiently/

You sound like Tim Ferriss and you make me want to ignore you in the same way I ignore him. I don't want to do this because you seem like a good person with a genuine ability to help others. Don't lose that.

Comment author: MileyCyrus 01 January 2012 07:34:14AM *  2 points [-]

What are the warmest gloves known to humanity? I have poor circulation in my hands and none of the store gloves ever keep my hands warm outside.

Comment author: jswan 06 January 2012 01:57:24AM *  1 point [-]

I have poor circulation (a touch of Reynaud's syndrome) as well, and I've tried a great many products in the context of cycling, ice climbing, and just general being outside in the cold. The short answer is that there are no gloves that will reliably keep your hands warm and allow you to retain dexterity if you're not getting your heart rate up to promote circulation. Mittens work better, by far. In no particular order, here are some more long winded tips:

1) Use mittens whenever possible. Ones that allow skin-to-skin contact between your fingers work best.

2) Keep gloves in your pockets and switch from the mittens to the gloves when you need dexterity.

3) Cut off a pair of small wool socks to make wrist warmers. This helps but isn't a panacea.

4) Use chemical handwarmers when necessary.

5) If you have to use gloves, some relatively cheap options that work well include, in order of warmth: a) freezer gloves, b) lined elk skin gloves (available at large hardware stores), c) Gore Windstopper gloves, available in outdoor shops.

6) Try to keep your heart rate up when outside, with your hands below your heart. This helps a lot.

7) Never wear wet gloves. If you're going to get wet, alternate two or more pairs of gloves and keep the extras inside your jacket where they will stay warm and dry out a bit.

8) Consider vapor barrier gloves or mittens from RBH Designs if you want to spend some real money. I have not personally tried their handwear, but their vapor barrier socks are impressively warm and perform as advertised.

Comment author: orthonormal 27 December 2011 12:48:19AM 4 points [-]

I think that the biggest error I see in general among self-described rationalists is the tendency to undervalue experience.

There are a couple of things you could mean by this. Can you give an example?

Comment author: jswan 27 December 2011 03:02:57AM 9 points [-]

There are indeed a couple of different ways I do mean it, but my best specific examples come from athletics. About eight or nine years ago I started getting seriously interested in long distance trail running. Like most enthusiastic autodidacts I started reading lots of material about shoes, clothing, hydration, nutrition, electrolytes, training, and so on. As I'm sure you've seen, a lot of people on the Internet can get paralyzed by analysis in the face of vast easily available information. In particular, they have a lot of trouble sorting out conflicting information gained from other knowledgeable people.

Frequently, further research will help you arrive at less-wrong conclusions. However, in some endeavors there really is a great deal of individual variation, and you just have to engage in lengthy, often-frustrating self-experimentation to figure out what techniques or training methods work best for you. This base of experience can't really be replaced by secondary research. Where research skill comes in, though, is in figuring out where to focus that secondary research (and this in itself is a skill that is honed by experience). As a friend of mine likes to put it: the best practitioners of [insert skill here] in the world perform almost all components of their skill the same way. They all have weird idiosyncrasies too. The place to focus your research is in the areas they have in common.

Anyway, this is a longer response than I had intended, and undoubtedly this is not new to you; it's just variation on standard cognitive bias. However, I think that deferral of experience and self-experimentation in favor of secondary research (aka, analysis paralysis) is a common bias blind-spot among rationality enthusiasts.

Comment author: jswan 26 December 2011 10:10:07PM 14 points [-]

I've been lurking here on and off since the beginnings at OB, IIRC, though more off than on. Expressed in the language of the recent survey: I'm an 43-year-old married white male with an advanced humanities degree working in the technical side of for-profit IT in the rural USA. I was raised in a non-theist environment and was interested in rationality tools from an early age. I had a spontaneous non-theistic mystical experience when I was 17 that led me to investigate (but ultimately reject) a variety of non-materialist claims. This led to a life-long interest in the workings of the brain, intuition, rationality, bias, and so on.

I enjoy LW primarily because of the interest in conscious self-improvement and brain hacking. I think that the biggest error I see in general among self-described rationalists is the tendency to undervalue experience. My thinking is probably informed most strongly by individual athletics, many of the popular writers in the rationalist tradition, and wide variety of literature. These days, I'm nursing obsessions with Python programming, remote backcountry cycling, and the writing of Rebecca Goldstein.

View more: Prev | Next