Comment author: Romashka 19 February 2016 12:10:48PM 0 points [-]

No role in natural ecosystems? Large herbivores certainly do, unless you would rather the woods and shrubbery cover vast expanses which are now grazed into meadowhood - but that would likely have lots of negative consequences, including wildlife loss from edge habitats (and even from quite transformed ones).

Now, chickens are different...

Comment author: necate 19 February 2016 12:34:27PM 0 points [-]

I am in favour of continuing to farm animals on places where you can't grow crops, simply because i value humans higjer than animals and this increases overall food supply. But today we are talking mainly about animals that are feedet with plants. If the grassland cant be used to grow eatable plants it can stay grassland and have cows on it.

Comment author: Val 18 February 2016 04:56:20PM *  1 point [-]

Meat requires us to kill animals. Factory farmed animals are in a considerable amount of pain for most of their life.

Animals living in the wild are in a considerable amount of pain when they starve to death, freeze to death, are chased by predators, and are eaten by predators in many cases while they are still alive.

I'm not holding your arguments invalid. Indeed, they are valid arguments to be made. However, they are not without their counter-arguments.

Another problem not yet addressed is what to do with the excess domesticated animals in the theoretical case when meat eating dropped significantly. What to do with their species in the theoretical case meat eating disappeared? (Not that these are any strong arguments in favor of eating meat, but might be strong arguments against banning eating meat)

Comment author: necate 19 February 2016 08:33:06AM 1 point [-]

I believe that animals in the wild have a way better pain/pleasure ratio. As they are allowed to follow their natural instincts. Also there is nothing I can do againt the pain of wild animals without a huge risk to completely destroy our ecosystem. That risk does not exist with factory farmed animals.

Domesticated animals would mostly disappear. You can keep some in zoos maybe, but not many. I currently dont see the problem with that. They play no roll in the natural ecosystem and I dont see a reason, why keeping species alive is inherently good. I definitely dont have a preference for the existence of as many species as possible.

Comment author: Coacher 18 February 2016 10:49:43AM 2 points [-]

Looking from utilitarian perspective, why don't you consider the pleasure of eating meat here at all?

Comment author: necate 19 February 2016 08:18:35AM 1 point [-]

Because the pleasure of eating meat is very small conpared to the pain of a factory farmed animal. And I find it very unlikely, that i end up in a state, where I do not fully discount animal utility (in which case i would. Just continue to eat meat out of habit, without deliberately conaidering pleasure) , but discount it so much, that my very small pleasure of eating meat compares to a livetime of pain for the animal.

Comment author: LessWrong 18 February 2016 05:07:41PM 0 points [-]

Can you back up "vegitarias are jsut as healthy or even healthier than non vegitarians."?

Comment author: necate 19 February 2016 08:11:27AM 0 points [-]

I have read it on countless sources, and I have read nothing against it. However as I said, it is a waste of time to do deliberate research on it at the Moment. If i come to the conclusion that i have no ethical concerns with eating meat, i will continue to so. And in this case I dont have to bother with the health issues of a vegitarian diet. So this is something I do after I have made the ethical decision.

Comment author: LessWrong 17 February 2016 07:51:01PM *  1 point [-]

I couldn't find 'nutrition' here. Was there a reason this part was ignored?

One last thing: what do you think about synthetic meat? I'm curious because I never see it mentioned - it's basically the 'everyone wins' situation.

FRIENDLY EDIT AND WARNING: I have a feeling this might be a sensitive topic so don't feel bad if a few people go at you or something. (Last guy that touched a sensitive issue didn't do well.)

Comment author: necate 17 February 2016 08:26:16PM *  1 point [-]

Nutrition is something that I would cover in case I don't want to eat meat anymore, Andi really do not expect this to be a non solveable problem. most things I have seen (although i have not deliberatly looked into this topic) seem to indicate that vegitarias are jsut as healthy or even healthier than non vegitarians. Vegans migh have some issues (Vitamin b12 and Iron for women) but those can be easily fixed by taking pills.

There are definetly no major heath issues with vegitarism since lots of people live that way and have no obvious problems (and doctors who check their health don't find anything wrong) If there are minor drawbacks I would be willing to accept them in case I really come to the conclusion that aninals feel pain, because the huge amount of pain I prevent would outweight small drawbacks.

Comment author: Gunnar_Zarncke 15 May 2015 10:14:03PM 0 points [-]

"so you do it" is rude. I take no offense as I see that you seem to have difficulty with the language. You could have said "please feel free to post a poll". And I will shortly.

Comment author: necate 15 May 2015 11:01:36PM 1 point [-]

OK, sorry I am not a native speaker and I did not percieve it to be rude.

Comment author: sixes_and_sevens 14 May 2015 09:18:03PM 3 points [-]

Why?

1) It's largely pointless in terms of one's behaviour and psychological well-being. If you have an all-consuming infatuation and you're not acting on it, the reason for not acting probably isn't because some test statistic hasn't crossed a predesignated threshold.

2) The whole sentiment of "I will calculate your love for me" is attached to a cluster of non-attractive features that probably get binned as "creepy". No, this isn't right. No, this isn't fair. But it is the case.

3) The notion of a "prior" on other people being attracted to you is essentially asking "how attractive am I?" This is information that can't be deduced by observing other people's romantic behaviour, any more than you can measure your own height by reading about other people's height.

Your attractiveness is not some inherent frequency by which people think you're attractive: it's made up of all the attributes and behaviours that people like about you. Maybe you should figure out what those things are and how to make them shine more, rather than trying to guess the odds on any given person finding you attractive.

Comment author: necate 15 May 2015 10:48:14PM 0 points [-]

Since not everyone thinks my approach is totally wrong like it seemed in the beginning I will re-enter this discussion although I said that I would abandon the approach. I did plan to abandon it, not because I understood why it was completely wrong but because I saw the massive dislike of it as enough evidence to believe it is wrong.

Concerning 1)

As I mentioned my point was not to do nothing, try to analyse and then come to some kind of result whether another person likes you. It is to assign probabilities on whether that person has a crush on you in order to decide how to act.

Concerning 2) If you decide to do certain things in the process of flirting you always assign probabilities to whether to person has a crush on you or not. If this would not be the case than there would be no development in the flirting process. You would give exactly the same signals at the beginning and at the end. You only progress to more obvious signals because based on what you have seen before you think it is more probable that that person likes you. The only question is do you let your subconscious assign the probabilities or do you make a conscious effort to do that. Most people will let their subconscious assign the probabilities. I agree that a lot of people will find it creepy if I decide to make conscious decisions here, but A) I do not have to let them know that I make a conscious decision and B) those people would probably also have problems with me making conscious decisions on other issues where they do not and if a person is not willing to accept that that is how I make my decisions it is probably the wrong person anyway.

Concerning 3) yes my attractiveness something specific to me. But my attractiveness is not the only factor deciding how likely it is for someone to have a crush on me. I am not sure how to explain this properly, but in a world where every person would only have a crush on someone once in his/her entire life the chance of someone having a crush on me would be lower than in a world where people on average have a crush on a hundred people during their life. In the second world there are just way more crushes to be distributed and I don’t see why regardless of my attractiveness I should not get more of them. Therefore I think it is relevant to know how many crushes other people have in general. Of course I cannot say that the prior for someone having a crush on me is the same as the average prior of people having a crush on other people in general. But my believe about the prior for myself should be related to the average prior.

Comment author: OrphanWilde 15 May 2015 06:08:33PM 0 points [-]

Downvoted. "Can you point me at information on how to do this" would be a better sentiment, or "I don't know how, and the changes don't have enough value to me to figure it out; I'd be happy to install any changes you make, however". Demanding somebody else's time, OTOH, is just plain rude.

Comment author: necate 15 May 2015 06:10:16PM *  2 points [-]

Please read before you downvote: He wrote: "I can do if you don't know how" he offered me to do it for me. So how is it rude to accept an offer?

Comment author: Good_Burning_Plastic 15 May 2015 10:16:26AM 1 point [-]

Are you sure you don't want to ask about the respondent's age and relationship status in the survey?

Comment author: necate 15 May 2015 06:08:11PM *  0 points [-]

Might have been a god idea to do this in the beginning, hovever I do not expect to get many more answers so adding it now will probably not leed to any reliabel results. in fact I think the total number of answers will be so low that it will be impossible to devide the sample into subgroups and still have enough answers in each subgroup to get reliable results.

Also I wanted to keep the number of questions as low as possible in order to encourage people to participate.

Comment author: Gunnar_Zarncke 14 May 2015 08:09:00PM *  1 point [-]

I took your survey and recommend the following changes:

  • Allow zero as an allowed value. I tried to set 0 and failed.

  • Consider allowing non-integer values (I considered 0,5)

  • Add a text field for comments (I wanted to give the above feedback there; it also allows simple anonymous feedback in a way LW doesn't - beware trivial inconveniences)

  • Consider to add a field to give personal estimate of crush-ratios - you can use the to report calibration

Note that you could much increase participation by adding a LW poll of the same. I can do if you don't know how.

Comment author: necate 15 May 2015 06:03:48PM 0 points [-]

I dont know how, so you do it

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