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no, I'm right: in the example above a situation can simultaneously be zero-rum and positive-sum. depends on which level of analysis you look at: individual or the group. the multi-level issue is just one of the many fatal flaws in the proposal.
I'm afraid that I don't see how your argument holds water, and simply saying you are correct and repeating your earlier claim fails to help. No one is claiming that there aren't zero sum situations, or claiming that there aren't situations that might be zero sum or non-zero sum depending on the level of analysis. The claim being made is that there are situations which are unambiguously not zero sum. You haven't addressed that.
tell me: is the author's "fight" against zero-sum bias only applicable to situations where a positive-sum outcome is possible or does the struggle against zero-sumness apply generally i.e. we should fight our internal zero-sum biases in all situations in case one of them is actually a positive-sum situation that we might miss?
This question makes me wonder if you have read the sequences (they are linked at the upper right hand of the LW page). In general, whenever we have any cognitive bias, the best thing to do is to reduce that cognitive bias. Thus, we should try to be aware when a given bias (in this case a tendency to see zero sum situations where it is not) might be showing up.
if it's a general struggle that applies to every situation then the individual can't achieve a positive-sum life because there would be Hawkish situations in which the positive-summer (Dove) would lose.
It may help for you to read the Sequences. No one is claiming that one should act like something is not zero sum when it is. Dealing with a cognitive bias is not accomplished by doing everything the exact opposite of what that bias would push you towards. Reversed stupidity is not intelligence. Fighting a cognitive bias doesn't mean assuming the exact opposite. It means being aware of the bias and being alert for when the bias may be influencing judgment.
btw the English language has a word for individuals who wrongly label zero-sum situations as positive-sum: naïve. I can't think of a word to describe individuals who wrongly label positive-sum situations as zero-sum but maybe I'm not trying hard enough...
And the limits of the English language matters for these purposes why exactly?
Also, is it possible, if you please, to work a tiny bit on your grammar and punctuation? They make it harder to read what you have to say. I suspect that they are one, somewhat superficial reason you are being voted down. Capitalizing the first word in each sentence would be a nice start.
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Ok, minor note, the standard quote format on LW uses a ">" at the beginning of what you want to quote.
Then you don't seem to actually disagree much with the essay in question.
So? It isn't going to apply in every situation. I'm going to try to make this point one last time because it doesn't seem to be sinking in: The claim isn't that we should see situations as not zero sum when they are, or that we shouldn't be careful to consider what the sums are for different groups. The assertion is that people have a tendency to see things as zero sum even when they are not. Do you see why giving an example that is zero sum in some sense and not in another doesn't impact the validity of that claim?
Unfortunately, humans are not naturally good Bayesianisms. We're not even naturally good traditional rationalists. We have a lot of cognitive biases. When we talk on LW about fighting we mean fighting against those biases so we can reason more accurately. Don't confusion fighting with some sort of deep ideological meaning. In this sense, fighting means something like grappling with oneself. The only ones we are fighting with is our imperfect reasoning algorithms that evolved to handle a very different environment.
Yes, but why is it new and useful information to know that people might have a zero-sum bias when one is aware one does not have an objective way to decide whether one should act to correct it in any given situation - i.e. should preference be given to the individual or the group, or the group or groups?
The concept "fight zero-sum bias" is just another way to say "think positive", "always look on the bright side of life", "be optimistic". It's nothing new, except the word "fight" makes this version war-like.
I find the use of the word "fight" disconcerting. It's a messy word. The way we think is a mechanical process. If there is a right way to think it has the potential to be explained. The word "fight", which carries emotional and irrational connotations, need never be invoked. I don't think this is a trivial point.
It's possible that a zero-sum scenario may appear positive-sum once the zero-sum bias has been corrected, but that is merely a short term illusion because the fate of the individual is also tied to that of the group.
Also I disagree with the idea human psychology has evolved to "think the worst" of each other. Can it be proved we have a zero-sum bias? In many situations it would be more helpful to counter positive-sum bias - in Ponzi schemes, for example, not everyone can be a winner.