All of Dias's Comments + Replies

Dias00

Unfortunately in writing the article Vox themselves seem to have fallen prey to some of the same stupidity; if you're familiar with Vox's general left-wing sympathies you'll be unsurprised that the examples of stupidity used in the article are overwhelmingly from right-wing sources. If you really want to improve people's thinking, you need to focus on your own tribe at least as much as the enemy tribe.

I previously wrote about this here.

6passive_fist
The example they give is actually anti gun control (it is a contrived example of course) and they repeatedly mention that the biases in question affect individuals who identify as left-wing as well as individuals who identify as right-wing. Why? I looked at your linked article and the two articles it links to and I can't find any proof that doing what you say would result in fewer disagreements than not doing that.
Dias50

I am bound by many contracts signed by Congress and they didn't even have well-aligned incentives.

3[anonymous]
The general hypothetically good idea of a government is to have one group that can do such things for the common good and to avoid coordination problems. It often doesnt exactly fulfill that role, but that is an indictment of their behavior rather than license for other groups to behave the same.
Dias00

Thanks for the suggestions!

  • My plan was to include a 1-day lag of the independent variable as a control variable in some of the regressions and see what effect that had.

  • Yep, plan to do that, and then also add a 'date' control variable as well.

Dias90

repeat, as I posted at the end of the last Open Thread, probably too late in its life for comments.

I'm planning on running an experiment to test the effects of Modafinil on myself. My plan is to use a three armed study:

  • Modafinil (probably 50mg as I am quite small)
  • B12 pill (as active control) or maybe Vitamin D
  • Passive Control (no placebo)

Each day I will randomly take one of the three options and perform some test. I was thinking of dual-n-back, but do people have any other suggestions?

Dias40

I'm planning on running an experiement to test the effects of Modafinil on myself. My plan is to use a three armed study:

  • Modafinil (probably 50mg as I am quite small)
  • B12 pill (as active control) or maybe Vitamin D
  • Passive Control (no placebo)

Each day I will randomly take one of the three options and perform some test. I was thinking of dual-n-back, but do people have any other suggestions?

0Douglas_Knight
Keep in mind that modafinil has a half-life of ~16 hours. You might want to allow a day in between samples. If you don't, plan to take this into account in the analysis. Whatever test you do, try it a bunch before starting the experiment to get through a lot of the learning period.
Dias00

You've misunderstood Jacob's suggestion. Under his system there are no 'claims' - the health insurer simply pays for whatever healthcare it thinks will extend promote your health, up to the value it gets from your prolonged health (presumably around $100k / QALY )

Dias00

The government is incentivised to keep people alive and paying tax, and disincentivised to treat people unnecessarily.

Unfortunately I don't think that's true:

Many Californians - most Californians - are assets. That is: productive citizens, or children who will grow up and become productive citizens. Their place is the left side of the balance sheet. Their presence in California increases California's productive power, and thus its value as a financial asset.

As the King begins the transition from democracy, however, he sees at once that many California

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027chaos
I appreciate the point and agree with it, but in fairness to the financial prudence folks if the government were to start executing citizens that would have major costs down the line. I would not expect a government concerned with financial prudence to do such executions if they were at all intelligent. It's cheaper to give unproductive people welfare than to round them all up and kill them, once you take matters of political economy into consideration on the accounting sheet.
2TheAncientGeek
I can see that private health insurance companies wouldn't want to take in bad risks. They don't in some US states, and are forced to by the federal government in others, I can also see that a profit driven GovCo would behave like a giant private insurer. But actual in-GovCo governments are incentivised to provide universally access to healthcare as they do to the law and education. I can vouch that where you have public healthcare, any hint that some group is excluded creates a stink. Health insurance provides better incentives than piecemeal provision, but public healthcare has better incentives than both.
Dias00

Thanks very much, this is very helpful. I had never heard of the books that I guess it looked like I was writing fanfic for!

0gjm
Nor had I! Google is a wonderful thing...
Dias100

In a small attempt to help, I cross-post all my high-quality LW-relivant posts to LW.

Dias00

I don't suppose someone who knows lisp (?) could explain the comment someone made on reddit here ? Despite writing the original story, I don't understand their explanation!

1gjm
The "Let overwrite, let override" thing is a reference to this and this (see also). (And this, not the code, is what Sagebrysh is saying was enlightening.) The Lisp code (more specifically, Scheme code) doesn't altogether make sense, and I suspect (1) was posted mostly because "let" is a keyword in Scheme as well as a prominent part of the meme trigger phrase in those books and (2) is as much a comment on the brief thing it's replying to as to the original story. I'll say a few words about it anyway, but what follows is likely to be unsatisfying. The code uses what's possibly Scheme's most confusing feature, namely call-with-current-continuation (commonly abbreviated call/cc) but unless I'm missing something it does so completely unnecessarily. The code posted is equivalent to this: (let (overwrite override) (cond (meme? (overwrite it)) (else it))) [EDITED to add: eww, the indentation is messed up and I don't know how to fix it; please imagine that line 2 is indented a little relative to line 1, and lines 3 and 4 a bit further relative to line 2.] at which point it may be worth mentioning that Scheme is an "expression-oriented" language where every language construct is an expression that has a value. In this case, let establishes a local scope (i.e., a region of the program in which particular names have values assigned to them). The particular form used here isn't strictly legal Scheme, but by analogy with Common Lisp I believe it's intended to create the names overwrite and override and make them both nil or something of the kind. cond is like "if" in other languages (it's actually a bit more powerful, but it's used here in a way equivalent to an "if"). There had better be, as a result of code not shown here, something called meme? in existence. If it's true (which actually means "any value other than the special one meaning false") then the value of the let-expression will be the result of calling (overwrite it); otherwise it will be the value o
Dias20

Good idea; done!

Dias20

in which case you would be begging the question.

No, I am explaining how the appearance of transgender people is consistent with the conservative view: they are simply confused. I am not assuming anything.

3[anonymous]
The point being that that conclusion is contrary to the experience of the people involved.
Dias30

a counterexample to their existing model of the human condition

I'm not sure how this could be counted as a counterexample to anyone's model. Presumably most people would agree that there are people who are confused about their sexuality. It would only be a counterexample to that model if the student was correct, but whether or not the student is correct is precisely what we are discussing.

If James agreed with the student, this would not be a counterexample to his beliefs, and if he disagrees with the student, it he would not agree that they represented a counterexample to the model.

4minorin
"Confused about their sexuality" is a particularly uncharitable characterization of a transgender person. Many are not confused, rather absolutely certain. Unless you're using the term "confused" as a polite way of indicating that you believe such a person to be mistaken or delusional, in which case you would be begging the question. By the way, gender is not the same thing as sexuality. If one models gender as a boolean switch that can be set to either "male" or "female", and encounters an individual who has a combination of "male" and "female" characteristics, their model may not accommodate the new observation. I have watched people (who I previously considered fairly sane) break into a yelling fit when confronted with someone undergoing a gender transition, demanding to know their "real" gender and hurling insults when the response was not what they expected.
Dias60

What does it mean to be female? It has to be something such that babies, animals and people in tribal cultures can be classified as female or not. Lets call this property, that baby girls, hens and women in hunter-gatherer tribes share, and baby boys etc. do not, property P. People who identify as female are presumably claiming they have property P, and presumably think this is a substantive claim.

Now, could P be something such that merely believing you had property P, made you have property P? Certainly there are some properties like this:

  • X has P if a
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3philh
Why? We use the word "female" when referring to babies and animals, but that doesn't mean we're necessarily talking about the same thing as when we refer to adult humans; and if we are, it doesn't mean that we're talking about something they actually have. (I assume that it doesn't make sense to talk about whether a baby is straight or gay, for example.)
Dias40

I think of it as outsourcing my RSS feed.

Obviously YMMV; I work in investment.

2philh
FWIW, I unsubbed from MR shortly after subscribing. It kind of felt like reading through someone else's RSS feed, with small amounts of commentary which often assumed more economic literacy than I actually have.
0sixes_and_sevens
I suggest browsing the opinions page for mentally delicious tab explosions.
Dias20

I like the test. It seems to have multiple levels, each of which Brennan passes:

  • Can you do a simple bayes theorem calculation?
  • Can you resist conformity bias when necessary?
  • Can you spot when you're fed bad data?
Dias20

There are cases like this!

  • There were some people who drilled very straight tunnels and laid fibreoptic cables through them. They knew people were willing to pay a lot for this, but didn't realize it was High-Frequency-Traders wanting a faster connection between Chicago and NYSE.
  • Some producers of intermediate goods see demand fluctuate from month to month, but have little idea why, or whether the fluctuations will persist.
Dias20

Do people who passionate argue for buying a home instead of renting violate the Efficient Market Hypothesis?

The explanation for this market inefficiency, as for so many others, is the government. There are massive tax benefits to owner-occupied housing, like the non-taxation of imputed rent. This means that the value of a house to a homeowner exceeds the value to a landlord. This plus the liquidity-constraints of the marginal homebuyer mean that the marginal house is worth more to the marginal homebuyer than he is able to pay for it.

As for whether peopl... (read more)

2[anonymous]
I thought it is just the US-specific stuff, then I realized that the rent non-taxation applies everywhere the landlord is supposed to pay income tax on the rent, except where it is cash under the table, except where landlords are offshore companies with tax shenaningans, except where it is rented from a non-profit co-op, this third is actually our case. But this gives a useful heuristic, if anyone pays tax on your rent - I think our co-op doesn't but I need to verify it - that is an argument for ownership. I too have noticed that the weird part of taxation is that it encourages barter and DIY. This is not every efficient. It is value in general and not cash movements that ought to be taxed, but of course it is both hard and useless, as governments need cash to finance services. I wonder what non-market-distorting tax ideas exist. I think our co-op or non-profit organizations in general, if they are tax-free or tax-reduced, are good ways to deal with these distorting effects. If we ever decide to buy a property, we will probably look into a credit union mortgage, not a for-profit bank, and not necessarily because profits are evil but because - probably, need to find out - non-profits are not or lower taxed.
Dias00

I don't think so - an important part of Pascal's Mugging is that the demon acts second - you produce a joint probability and utility function, and then he exploits the fact that the former doesn't fall as fast as the latter rises.

Dias00

Yes, I meant over adult children. I don't think this has much impact on minors.

Dias00

My pleasure! I love blog page-views.

Dias00

It also means that discovering the universe is older than we currently expect ould significantly raise the EV of such research. Any probability of non-finite history could cause the EV to blow up.

0dxu
That gets into Pascal's Mugging territory, I think.
Dias00

Hmm, an interesting combination of arguments!

I'll have to think about rebuttals. My concern is that by explicitly mentioning arguments that I think are silly we give them a certain level of credence. In some cases I've tried to indirectly address them, but maybe I should put more work into that. Alternatively I could write a separate 'Common Objections' article.

I'm really glad to see other people thinking these thoughts, and I would love to figure out how to make this a reality.

Awesome! I don't have much in the way of practical ideas here, beyond talking about it, writing about it, and posting links in high-readership locations.

Dias20

Yeah, that section is called speculative for a reason!

I guess the attractiveness of this option partly rests on whether you think parents generally have too much or too little influence/incentive/involvement in their children or not.

4ilzolende
As a minor: considering that I: * can't own things (I can buy them, but if someone can legally take the object which is legal for me to possess without some special, explicitly-legally-defined reason to do so and prevent me from accessing the object for arbitrarily long periods of time I wouldn't call it ownership) * seriously, even if I get a job on my own through connections I made on my own, people can just take away arbitrary objects I legally buy with that money, and it's not like taxes because I can't predict it in advance and I lose non-interchangable resources (I can't decide that I would rather lose [amount of money equal to the cost of renting a computer for a few days] in place of [access to my computer with my files for a few days]) * have no legal right to privacy beyond rather limited forms of confidentiality when talking to doctors/lawyers/certain religious leader types (if my parents want to copy my backup drive and have someone decrypt it for them, the only thing stopping them is software, I couldn't file a police report) * have no real right to freedom of religion, people could punish me for refusing to attend religious services if they wanted to * have no right to view my own medical records, my parents can see the results of IQ and psych tests I spent an entire Saturday taking and I can't I am kind of slanted towards the view that parents have too much influence over minors. I would, however, gladly give up some of my earnings to be able to own property and have the right to privacy.
Dias00

I think the same essential abuses that exist with debt exist here, so time-limitation (say equity stops yielding returns after 15-20 years, and can be discharged by bankruptcy) is important.

Yeah, so in the examples I assumed a 20yr duration. Note that student loan debt is currently not able to be discharged through bankruptcy though.

I worry about abuses when the equity stake is high. If you're a mentor, and your investment decides they don't really want to prioritize income maximization, what will you do?

Take a loss? Investors are used to small part... (read more)

Dias10

I basically agree with everything you said.

With regards the race and socio-economic background issue, I agree, only noting that this is similarly an issue for job applications and other financial products. Reality is not race-blind; at some point you have to deal with it, and this is not a special case.

Perhaps it would be easier to do in England (or some other non-US country) for this reason.

0owencb
I somewhat agree with that point, but this would bring it out into the open as an explicit effect, which might be more controversial. Of course anti-discrimination legislation might mean that the contracts on offer were only allowed to depend on certain parameters.
Dias00

Yeah, good point. You could address this through contingencies - have it be part of the contract that you had to carry on in engineering - but I expect investors would simply have to take the hit. This is basically the issue I was talking about in the section on Adverse Selection.

Dias20

The expected income of an incoming freshman engineering student versus the expected income of a graduating engineering student are two very different numbers.

Yup, I agree. Incoming freshmen who said they wanted to do engineering might get a slight discount - only a year or two in, once they've passed some courses and actually declared would they get the full discount. I figure this is the sort of thing the market is capable of pricing in.

Dias20

Congratulations! You are very unusually virtuous.

Dias20

Sure, maybe you think it's not morally obligatory. But EAs who think it's good to give 10% generally think it's better to give 20%, and similarly maybe it is permissible to abort a baby but morally better to not.

2V_V
And they may also think that it is even better to give 100% minus living expenses, but at the end of the day most of them don't do it.
Dias40

you would support impregnating every fertile female, voluntarily or forcibly, if you expect this to maximize QALY

No, but that's not what the repugnant conclusion is. The RC is about the desirability of an end-state - highly populous worlds could be very desirable and yet some methods for achieving such worlds still be morally impermissible. There can be side-constraints, to use Nozick's (?) terminology, or other values at stake.

You might find [this article] on population ethics interesting.

Or do you qualify it by saying "maximize the QALYs of eve

... (read more)
Dias00

Yeah there are many cases where the math I did would produce a different answer. But I think this concern at least remains hypothetical.

Dias90

pick-pocketing

If you add "socially useful" or "not immoral" obviously this is excluded.

Kindly100

High barrier to entry. I expect that at my current skill level I'd get caught pick-pocketing the first time I tried it, and that would impact my ability to try it a second time.

Dias30

Your guess would be mistaken! I think I am much more concerned about the autonomy than the average EA, which is a large part of the reason I write the only libertarian effective altruist blog I'm aware of.

But most EAs do not seem to care about autonomy, hence why I pointed out than autonomy arguments, a classic pro-abortion argument, are not available to them.

Meta: I think you may have had a negative reaction to my post because you (perhaps reasonably) pattern-matched me as an ideological opponent, which I think is a (perhaps reasonable) mistake. I think s... (read more)

Dias20

Yes I deliberately avoided discussing the law for this reason, and to try to keep down the number of open worm-filled cans.

Dias20

Full open boarders, although Michelle partly disagreed here, and many have concerns about immigration's effects on domestic policy/crime etc.

Dias40

As someone who's had a very nuanced view of abortion, as well as a recent EA convert who was thinking about writing about this, I'm glad you wrote this. It's probably a better and more well-constructed post than what I would have been able to put together.

Thanks! It took a long time - and was quite stressful. I'm glad you liked it.

The argument in your post though, seems to assume that we have only two options, either to totally ban or not ban all abortion,

I actually deliberately avoided discussing legal issues (ban or not ban) because I felt the pur... (read more)

1Darklight
I had another thought as well. In your calculation, you only factor in the potential person's QALYs. But if we're really dealing with potential people here, what about the potential offspring or descendants of the potential person as well? What I mean by this is, when you kill someone, generally speaking, aren't you also killing all that person's future possible descendants as well? If we care about future people as much as present people, don't we have to account for the arbitrarily high number of possible descendants that anyone could theoretically have? So, wouldn't the actual number of QALYs be more like +/- Infinity, where the sign of the value is based on whether or not the average life has more net happiness than suffering, and as such, is considered worth living? Thus, it seems like the question of abortion can be encompassed in the question of suicide, and whether or not to perpetuate or end life generally.
Dias30

Yeah I think the repugnant conclusion is not actually very repugnant; it just seems so because of scope insensitivity.

But I would stress that the argument I make doesn't rely on your having a goal of maximizing QALYs. You might assign some credence to other moral views that take a stance on aborting fetuses; deontology, for example, or even just 'maximize the QALYs of everyone who is already alive.'

4Shmi
Not very repugnant? Are you saying that you would support impregnating every fertile female, voluntarily or forcibly, if you expect this to maximize QALY? Or do you qualify it by saying "maximize the QALYs of everyone who is already alive"? Then you are back to the definition of when to count fetus as alive, and this is again a Schelling point argument, EA or no EA.
Dias00

On the other hand we also have to take into account the reduced quality of other people's lives due to the existence of the new person: the resources she will consume, the work required to bring her up.

Yep, but it seems plausible these would be outweighed by the value she will create for others, assuming she eventually gets a job, pays taxes, etc. Assuming you think humanity is net positive value, absent some particular reason to think the child will be negative it seems reasonable to assume she will be positive.

Btw, I think temporal discount is neces

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0Squark
I mostly agree, however there have to be scenarios in which another person is a net negative, if we're to avoid the repugnant conclusion. Moreover, in the case of abortion we're considering an undesired child which might mean psychological damage both to the child and the unwilling parent. To take an extreme example, consider pregnancy from rape. According to UDT we have to compute the expectation value of the utility function over the whole "a priori" Tegmark IV multiverse (without conditioning on observations). A natural way to model this is considering the Solomonoff measure on the space of infinite sequences of bits (each such sequence is a "universe") . Thus the expectation value is an integral over all such sequences. It is natural to require the utility function to be bounded in order for the integral to converge (avoiding Pascal's mugger). Since each universe enters the integral together with its time translated versions, the resulting time asymptotics is 2^{-Kolmogorov complexity of t} which decays only slightly faster than 1/t. This result doesn't depend on the details of the time discount in the "bare" utility function: it is a universality result. See also this.
Dias20

The physical state of the fetus is not in question; the 'surprising discovery' here would be that an abortion has some quality of badness, one which is not implied by a subjective observer's desires or a full and complete understanding of the physical system.

I think I have two responses:

  • Firstly, I sometimes am convinced to change my mind on moral issues as a result of purely moral arguments. Something like moral uncertainty seems to be at play.
  • I think there's some danger of equivocation with "full and complete understanding of the physical system.&
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Dias00

Else we'd say abstinence is fairly reprehensible, since it also prevents the creation of new people.

Yeah, I realise they're quite related positions. I often feel guilty for not having had children yet.

Can we factor that in?

My guess is that because everything is linear, treating a fetus as being like 0.3-person-weight will give you the same answer as treating them as having 1-person-weight with probability 30%

Dias70

There are a couple of very good comments on the EA forum cross-post, like this, this and this

Dias00

Great post. You can think of lots of on-going choices like this; whether to be nice to colleagues, for example, or making an effort to drive efficiently in a similar way. Accruals based accounting also gives you similar results, if you can manage the trick of actually assigning some amount of extra weight, unhappiness etc. to each unnecessary food item consumed.

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