All of John_D's Comments + Replies

John_D00

I suspect there is a communication barrier between high-IQ and average-IQ people. Also, people tend to connect with each other through shared interests, and many with high-IQ also have high openness, lending oneself to have unconventional interests. With fewer people like you, it can lead to literal social isolation, and a feeling of disconnectedness with others. I don't think this is autism per se, but I can see why many people with high IQs may think they have autism.

John_D00

I suspect there is a bidirectional relationship regarding quality relationships and cognition.

Even without direct evidence, there is indirect evidence that supports the lack of confidants affects cognition. Socializing is an experiment with measurable effects on cognition that I already mentioned. Animal models, which historically have been a pretty good proxy for human models, certainly support isolation affecting cognition. Prisoners put in solitary confinement show signs of deteriorating mental functioning. Close knit communities, not to be confused... (read more)

John_D00

An article in the Atlantic talks about a paradox in modern societies; people are more lonely despite (supposedly) more opportunities to interact with others. This also coincides with the rise of cognitive declining mental illnesses such as depression and anxiety. It references the falling of close confidants and more rocky relationships with family and spouses as a possible source. Indeed, 10 minutes of conversation can enhance cognition, less quality (but not quantity of) relationships predict cognitive decline in the elderly, and people with more frie... (read more)

0Fivehundred
I suffer from extreme social isolation, and I have a constant mental fog which sometimes lifts during periods of emotional intensity. By itself I think this is evidence that cognition is tied to social health. Not that it can tell you much else.
John_D00

This post hit a chord with me, and I am curious as to what actions you took to change it. Did you simply go somewhere different, or are you doing something different?

1buybuydandavis
Action 1 - attitude adjustment. Earlier comments. My current position is not Hell. I am not going home exhausted (though I should get more sleep). But I saw much greater possibilities with it than are bearing out. I think those possibilities are real, except for the behavior and attitudes of the people involved that keep the possibilities from becoming realities. At least for me, that's where frustration and crazy starts - being dependent on the decisions of others, particularly when I think they are making poor decisions. Attitude adjustment. Instead of being frustrated on what this place isn't, focus on all the desirable things I get out of it, what more I can get out of it, and at least attempt to get them to change their behavior that's limiting what this job is. But, also recall that there are other places, other opportunities, and I should start looking around at them. The world is full of wonderful opportunities. Life isn't that hard, and could be much better. One thing to note while reading my posts - I'm often trying to motivate myself. That was directed at myself as much as anyone else who could use a kick in the ass. It's from personal experience. Some people seem to think it's mean to say such things. I say them because I wish I had had someone to impress them upon me years ago. Validating someone in their hopelessness and learned helplessness is not compassionate, it is destructive. It's hard to find a legal way to hurt someone more.
John_D00

A problem with this experiment is that while Bill may be the same person in Interview A and B, the interviewers are not the same person. You can't know for sure if the VP in A would act like the CEO in B if Bill was interviewing for a managerial position. It is just as likely that the VP in A is simply a jerk who tries and one-up all interviewees, regardless of the status of the position they are interviewing for.

John_D00

Misnomer noted. So, is there evidence that conventional foods (or foods that are not organic) have adverse effects beyond possible nutritional differences, when compared to organic foods, and genetically modified vs. not modified? (and by not modified I mean not genetically modified, if the context preceding the words didn't make those words crystal clear) I am of course open to the possibility, but I would like to see harder evidence before paying a premium.

0Lumifer
Not to my knowledge.
John_D00

Are we trying to find out if organic foods are more nutritious, or if organic foods offer health benefits beyond nutrition? (or to reverse that, do inorganic foods offer adverse effects beyond nutrition) Remember I said , " Modified food may or may not have adverse effects beyond different nutrient contents (which so far is debatable)," The authors conclude in your 2nd link that they agree the evidence on the benefits of organic foods is scant at the moment.

0Lumifer
"Organic" and "non-modified" are very different things. "Organic" means that the food producer has received a particular kind of certification for his production. By the way, in this context the opposite of "organic" is "conventional", not "inorganic". "Non-modified" has a less well-defined meaning, but generally it means food as it comes from the farm, not from a factory. There is lots of "organic modified" and "conventional non-modified" food.
John_D00

Yes, that was a little extreme on my part. What I was trying to say is that people don't always respond to rational ideas.

"What does it mean for the world to be "saved"?"

I was trying to relate to the author's idea of "saving" the world, which from what I gather is maximizing altruism and bureaucratic inefficiencies, to start. (governments are inefficient, wars are bad, etc.)

John_D20

A place to start is to feed two groups of animals foods, one eating organic and the other eating inorganic, with identical or near-identical nutrient compositions, and see how they respond over time. Linking dietary effects between animal and human models has been done in the past, so it isn't too far-fetched. It won't be perfect, since the animals won't be humans, but it is certainly better than the paucity of data available, and assuming that organic = good with scarce evidence (see below).

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/92/1/203.short

2ChristianKl
In reality there no reason to assume that the health difference between organic and conventional bananas is the same as the health difference between organic and conventional butter.
4Lumifer
Here is one meta-study. Here is another one
John_D00

Some other ways to optimize sleep:

  • Metformin helps improve sleep, and a theorized mechanism is through improved glucose metabolism. This might also explain why exercise, which has a similar effect on glucose metabolism, improves sleep as well, and why deteriorating health worsens it.
  • Some blood pressure lowering drugs worsen sleep, but the possible mechanism is through melatonin suppression.

Source:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/dme.12362/full

John_D-20

From what I gather, most people don't respond to rational ideas and actions, just ideas and actions they believe will benefit themselves or their group. This is how bad ideas continue to flourish (Bigger Church = Pleasing the Lord = Better chance of an afterlife). In addition, people do respond to ideas they believe are moral, but what most people define as "good" or "bad" actions, moral or immoral, tend to be what people believe will benefit them or the group they relate to (family, community, country, etc.) As a rule of thumb, to ... (read more)

2Lumifer
You are confused between rationality and altruism. These are quite different things. What does it mean for the world to be "saved"?
John_D10

I'm surprised by the lack of research on organic foods and health, and it seems like it wouldn't be too hard for a talented researcher to compare the health and mortality of people who consume organic vs. inorganic diets, after controlling for differences between the two groups, such total nutrient consumption, exercise, premorbid conditions prior to organic consumption, etc. Modified food may or may not have adverse effects beyond different nutrient contents (which so far is debatable), but I'm surprised at the amount of people who have jumped on this ba... (read more)

0Stuart_Armstrong
Controlling doesn't get rid of all the confounders (easiest one: people who eat organic care more about what they eat, almost by definition - how do you control for that?), and long term studies are very hard to do.
John_D00

As you have already pointed out, people who eat nuts also engage in other healthy activities. It sort of reminds me of the studies on moderate drinkers and death. Perhaps people who are able to control their drinking after having one or two beers, have more self-control in other areas of their life, compared to those who are heavy drinkers or teetotalers who avoid it like the plague.

Even after controlling for all of this, I wonder if their is an optimal nut intake.

John_D30

Oddly enough, I find that the best way to get something done is to read a schedule that I made the day before. I somehow feel more obligated to stick to it than if I written it the day of. I can't fully explain why this is the case, perhaps due to the fact that I'm more fatigued by the time I've written one, but it seems to be the best way I found to hack my own procrastination. Tim Ferriss also advocates making a plan for the day or week ahead, although his reasons might be different than mine.

John_D00

With the card game in mind, I have doubts that most psychopaths can function on any executive level, and am not surprised at all that they overrepresent as prisoners.

Hare says that because narcissistic, histrionic, and obsessive compulsive tendencies are elevated in executives, it must mean that psychopaths are more common in executives as well, because after all these are "psychopathic tendencies" This is akin to saying that because someone has above-average self-esteem, they also have psychopathic traits. But if anyone really wants to po... (read more)

0Viliam_Bur
That makes perfect sense, thanks!
John_D00

Interesting observation. It is hard to find an in-depth article in Google Scholar on the idea that meditation or similar practices evolved to help us deal with stress and hone concentration. A recent study showed that nuns and monks who prayed or meditate showed increased activity in the parts of the brain implicated in analytical thinking and stress management.

My question is are these simply tricks we learned to deal with stress, or were they are part of human evolution to help cope with stress?

http://intro2psych.wordpress.com/2008/03/11/and-this-is-your-brain-on-prayers/

John_D40

I suspect that while dark triad traits are desirable to women, they aren't the only desirable traits. As you said, research shows that agreeableness and altruism also tend to be attractive, and conscientious and agreeable men tend to be better dancers, and thus more attractive. (quick google search) I suspect that there are multiple types of attractive men, or you can still possess all these traits.

Then again, it is important to know how the dark triad is measured to begin with. I am not sure if this is the actual test, but it looks legitimate. While... (read more)

John_D20

I disagree that the reason why many upper-middle class whites lean left is entirely philanthropic signalling. Some of it may be envy and power grabbing. A person making 120k a year may be living comfortably, but still not as comfortable as a person making 30 million a year. Let's not forget that many advocate raising the taxes of the top 1% of earners. This form of redistribution to the poor, if implemented, puts a burden on the extremely wealthy, which lowers the wealth and power of the elites, and thus puts the upper-middle class in closer position ... (read more)

John_D00

Interesting study since one of the hallmark symptoms of bipolar is a lack of sleep, and BDNF is lacking in bipolar individuals who are depressed. I think more research should be done to see if this therapy can throw someone into bipolar disorder.

A bothering trend in the psychiatric community, which is now being recognized by mental health professionals, is the overuse of labels without looking at the patient's individual symptoms and tackling them accordingly. The lack of objective tests also gives rise to misdiagnosis, even for severe disorders such a... (read more)

John_D20

I don't think it is an indicator that the audience is messed up. I haven't seen Battlestar Galactica but regarding Game of Thrones, if the boards are any indicator of the audience, then most people seem to root for the more morally acceptable (good) guys, and are disappointed that they keep getting screwed over. The show is also known for unexpected character deaths, so it could just be an indicator of the audience wanting to be surprised or in a state of suspense.

0AshwinV
I may be biased as a big GoT fan.. but I think Martin does a fantastic job. The depth that many of his characters possess is very very impressive. He certainly seems to follow the many parts formula when it comes to characters like Stannis and Theon.
John_D00

I didn't say the study mentioned it, I said that dietary patterns can change due to exercise. The link didn't say what they ate or didn't to maintain their weight, and I can imagine that increasing your total calories consumed can't be completely safe even if it is just for weight maintenance. That is why researchers need to control for changes in diet, changes in overall health unrelated to exercise (people do get diseases for various reasons, as I can imagine would be common to a group of previously sedentary participants), etc., to make sure adverse h... (read more)

John_D10

"I would doubt that the 12% adverse responders is a controlled result."

Exactly, especially when you consider a study that suggests a large portion of the population changes their dietary patterns, usually for the worse, after they begin exercise. So it is possible that the adverse responders began to up their caloric and fatty intake. Hopefully they controlled for change in diet and health at baseline, but considering the rigor of most studies, I doubt it.

Source: http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/16/does-exercise-make-you-overeat/

0NancyLebovitz
Some of the results from the lecture weren't connected to eating in an obvious way. What was checked was blood pressure, VO2max, muscle growth, and blood sugar/iinsulin. It's conceivable that the last would be affected by eating more high-glycemic food, and that muscle mass might be negatively affected if exercise was lowering some people's appetites too much. Actually, the study you cite doesn't mention that some people ate worse food, just more, and it's merely enough that they maintained a stable weight.
John_D50

It seems the results show on that some actually get worse, but I wouldn't say this is a firm conclusion that some should avoid exercise altogether. The problem with most experimental studies on exercise is that many use an across-the-board regimen for all participants that isn't customized to the individual. So, if one participant gets 30 mins a day at 70% of HRmax then all do. It is probable that some who get worse may need less or more exercise, greater or lesser intensity, resistance as opposed to aerobic, etc.

3aelephant
This is what came to mind to me too. If you have someone who is thoroughly unhealthy & metabolically broken, adding a bunch of exercise on top of that is not a positive stressor, it is likely to knock them down even further. You have to approach things in order, like fixing the diet & addressing potential issues like hypothyroidism before you start training them to be an athlete.
John_D00

I can imagine some abusing this technique for things that add little value to their lives but many feel have to get done, such as dusting their fan blades or making their office as neat (as opposed to efficient) as possible. Also, people who are already lazy may choose simpler tasks when applying this technique, as opposed to mentally draining tasks such as studying or improving set skills. Perhaps their should be an addendum to prioritizing goals that provide value (monetary, personal growth, etc.) within the 25 minute mark.

John_D00

This post sort of reminds me of this study: http://www.apa.org/research/action/smarter.aspx

" As compared to the control group, students who learned about intelligence's malleability had higher academic motivation, better academic behavior, and better grades in mathematics "

I suspect that belief that one can self-improve one's intelligence is partially explain by genetics as well. Another example of a trait that correlates with both behavior and intelligence is openness. Openness correlates with personal growth, need for cognition and crystalli... (read more)

John_D00

For someone who is overweight, and a lot of people are, losing weight is also a great way to increase your pullup quantity. (not to mention a host of other health benefits) Though, some would argue that it is easier to just gradually build your strength to do pullups than to drop 20-30 lbs.

John_D00

Anyone heard of this effect being replicated? It seems awfully steep (17 point drop?) to be believed. I ask because ideally we want to maximize cognition to maximize workplace and personal success, and this seems very detrimental to many people who are in lower-status positions within the hierarchy. It also may explain why some people seem to perform worse when their boss is hovering over them. If this is true, then there is some truth when people say, "Don't worry about what others are thinking".

An alternate explanation: It is possible tha... (read more)

John_D40

I suspect that a lot of people who aren't socially dominant in the traditional sense optimize for prestige (higher education to gain income, advertising intellect by getting a Phd, picking up an instrument, etc.) , which can be status enhancing, and thus still a display of dominance.

Of course, since the average person cares about social jockeying, sychophantism, and wit at the expense of others, it may help to learn some of these skills if your goal is to move up in the workplace.

1buybuydandavis
I think the relevant aspect of optimizing for presitige or status is in whose eyes is the status measured. Social intelligence, much like epistemic intelligence, often comes at a price. My sister and I would talk about compulsive analysis - just having some inconsistency bug you, and feel the need to resolve it. An obsessive compulsive disorder, where you just have to straighten out ideas and figure things out. Naturally, with that compulsion, you will tend to figure out a lot of things that others don't, just as someone with OCD will have a tidy house. (I'm going by the stereotype of OCD as an example, don't know how much the generalization is true). I think that's much the same with the social dominators, status seekers, and approval seekers. They just feel the need more. Other's approval counts to them. Their status in other people's eyes matters to them. They're motivated by it. Not surprisingly, with all that motivation, they work on it more, and get better at it. Alternatively, one could chase status, but in one's own eyes. Wanting to be the kind of person you respect. One can go further, and just do what you want to do. The phrase "just not that into you" applies to these last two types in ways alien to the social status seekers, just as "I don't need to know" is alien to the epistemically compulsive.
John_D00

Based on that link, I was a little surprised that openness decreases income. Considering its correlation with crystallized knowledge, I would have expected no effect or a positive one.

0gwern
If you broke it down by occupation, I'd guess the effect is coming from Openness driving people to careers that are paid less in cash and more in novelty or thinking.
John_D70

"Reason and Emotion are a tag team in decision making in ethical domains. They do their best work together."

That statement is too strong. I can think of several instances where certain emotions, especially negative ones, can impair decision making. It is reasonable to assume that impaired decision making can extend into making ethical decisions.

The first page of the paper linked below provides a good summary of when emotions, and what emotions, can be helpful or harmful in making decisions. I do acknowledge that some emotions can be helpful in... (read more)

John_D80

"I think it's quite right to view a guy making a bunch of unwanted advances as rather a jerk, depending on how much he makes rejecting him suck for the targets. He's generating a bunch of negative utility."

Yes in that situation one would be jerk, but not everyone was complaining about a bunch of advances (and I did say that some of the grievances were justified), but even one advance or something that could have been miscontrued as an advance. If we (safely) assume the anecdotes come from people who have freely given out their number or have let... (read more)

John_D60

"Often I hear guys complain that an advance is deemed "creepy" if it's unwelcome, but not if the same thing were said or done by an attractive man."

Yes that seems to be the crux of some criticism, and for good reason. Anyone who has been through high-school knows a lot of unattractive or socially undesirable men get tremendous backlash for behaviors that a desirable men get away with. It doesn't help that sometimes the word creep is a slur for an unattractive person hitting on another. The complaint goes beyond the double-standard, it... (read more)

8bogus
The word "right" seems to be unwarranted here. It's not clear that people have a moral right not to be exposed to rude or anti-social behavior, but this does not make the behavior any less rude or anti-social. There is such a thing as good etiquette, however minor and trifling it may be when contrasted with genuine ethical concerns. But an awkward geek may unwittingly behave in ways that make people mistake him for a creeper; reading Dale Carnegie is a good way to address this. As for legitimate creepers, it would be nice if they too could reform and stop posing a danger to others; unfortunately, most of them seem to be actively hostile towards other people and lacking in empathy, so this is not a likely prospect.
8TimS
This is not true. Actually creepy folks use unwillingness to reflect on social skills of society in general as camouflage. When called on their behavior, they can say something like "I was only joking" and escape most of the consequences. But if society as a whole was more explicit about social norms, then (1) people who have trouble picking up social norms would be happier because the norms would be easier to learn, (2) people who want others to follow the norms without being required to follow themselves would have less room to operate, and (3) people who want to change the social norms would have an easier time communicating the case for a change of the norms.
6syllogism
I didn't go to a coed highschool, but I imagine a lot of that backlash was status signalling, and the target of the advance wasn't genuinely aggrieved. So, that isn't just. But factoring that out, I think it's quite right to view a guy making a bunch of unwanted advances as rather a jerk, depending on how much he makes rejecting him suck for the targets. He's generating a bunch of negative utility. When I see guys with poor social skills complain about this, it basically amounts to saying that it's not fair. Sure --- it's not fair that looks and charm get parcelled out unevenly, but so what? You still don't get to make your problem someone else's. It's not fair that we become more unattractive as we age, but a 70 year old man who constantly makes unwelcome advances on young women is rightly viewed with contempt. It's not fair that gay men and women can very seldom hit on strangers with a good expected utility either. It doesn't make it okay for them to just "assume they're gay until stated otherwise", given that most people are straight.
John_D30

"Yes, people with divergent ideas are more likely to be exiled."

I did mention creative achievement as well, not just divergent thinking. So are musicians and actors among these exiled? These seem like the type of professions that are lauded in mainstream culture more than exiled. Creativity correlates both with being attractive to the opposite sex and suicidal ideation (not to mention suicidal completion). Now, sexual attraction doesn't necessarily prove that these are socially acceptable professions, but I think it is premature to call these... (read more)

1Bruno_Coelho
The risk to lose friends make people to rationalize their behavior to make them more similar to a group, convincing himself of some identity, or optimizing toward a set of habits of the average guy of her group. Additionally, contrarian thinking signals status too.
0Eugine_Nier
For much of human history yes.
John_D20

I like your post but have a criticism with his explanation for why people are not productive when depressed" "A lot of depressed people make statements like "I'm worthless", or "I'm scum" or "No one could ever love me", which are illogically dramatic and overly black and white, until you realize that these statements are merely interpretations of a feeling of "I'm about to get kicked out of the tribe, and therefore die."

I suspect that depression has multiple underlying causes depending on the individual.

S... (read more)

5NancyLebovitz
Why high fat rather than high simple carbs?
0Eugine_Nier
Yes, people with divergent ideas are more likely to be exiled. There are also many cultural and structural differences between industrial and pre-industrial societies, e.g., as Paul Graham mentioned in this essay:
John_D00

I personally think the original images used in the study are even worse choices, because at least there is some uniformity between displays of emotions taken from the article, which better control for possible confounders.

Now for the actual pics used in the study. In the set of male pics that are supposed to display pride, there seem to be far more pics that convey athleticism or wealth, as others have pointed out. In the happiness pictures, there seem to be far more close-ups and profile pics, with the rest of the body being hidden from the viewer. ... (read more)

John_D20

"For us to break the fourth wall, either our creators would have to desire it or be pretty bad at running simulations."

There is also the possibility that, assuming we live in a simulation, the creators simply do not care or mind whether they are discovered or not. This would also leave open the possibility of breaking the fourth wall.

John_D00

"If you're kind of good at (or interested in) analytical things, and kind of bad at (or uninterested in) social things, you'll specialize your own brain in that direction. It may even be in your best interest to specialize to some extent, to play to your strengths."

I agree with this. I would also like to add, especially with higher-functioning autistics , that they are quite aware of the practicality of social skills and status, and if wrongplanet users are any indicator, many if not most want to be genuinely socially adept. Regarding the NT vs... (read more)

John_D90

"upmanship and power jockeying, people who slap you on the back and call you "bro," obsessions with alcohol and sometimes drugs, fixation on team sports and celebrities"

These seem like common narrow-interests within the general population. I find fixations with a handful of interests common with many people, it just seems that those with ASD or ASD-like personalities have interests beyond the mainstream. I am a little bothered with the pathologizing of academic interests, particularly in STEM fields, as "narrow" and "al... (read more)

0A1987dM
OTOH, see the comment thread to this post.
John_D10

I also agree, especially if one is trying to look high-status to the average person in the general population. Science and rationality is still looked at as nerdy, unfortunately.

7Error
Oddly, I tend to feel like having high status among nerdy types is the only time it actually "counts." I get a rush when something I say here or within other nerd and geek communities is well received, or if I'm treated as an authority on X, etc...wheras, say, people calling me "sir" or otherwise treating me as higher-status at work makes me extremely uncomfortable. So do compliments from normals in general. [Edit: "Status granted by a tribe I don't identify with feels like a status hit instead" might be a good way to put it.]