That first point made me laugh. It’s exactly the type of mistake I expected to make, and I still didn’t see it coming.

I appreciate all this safety advice and will update my decision making based on that.

Geez, the weed thing surprises me. I hadn’t planned to smoke any until after the event. But I think I’ll avoid that now. I’m already struggling with motivation from jet lag. I don’t want to increase that feeling.

Hmmm, I think I’m mostly bad at those things. I’ll play it safe.

And thanks for the good idea! I’ve added a session at 3pm on the Sunday.

From Newcastle, Australia to Berkeley, San Francisco. I arrived yesterday for Less.online. I’ve had a bit of culture shock, a big helping of being increasingly scared, and quite a few questions. I’ll start with those. Feel free to skip them.

These questions are based on warnings I’ve gotten from local non-rationalists. Idk if they’re scared because of the media they consume or because of actual stats. I’m asking these because they feel untrue.

1. Is it ok to be outside after dark?
2. Will I really get ‘rolled’ mid day in Oakland?
3. Are there gangs walking around Oakland looking to stab people?
4. Will all the streets fill up with homeless people at night?
5. Are they chill? In Aus they’re usually down to talk if you are.

Culture shocks for your enjoyment:

1. Why is everyone doing yoga?
2. To my Uber driver: “THAT TRAIN IS ON THE ROAD!?”
3. “I thought (X) was just in movies!”
4. Your billboards are about science instead of coal mining!
5. “Wait, you’re telling me everything is vegan?” Thank Bayes, this is the best. All our vegan restaurants went out of business.
6. People brag about things? And they do it openly? At least, I think that’s what’s happening?
7. “Silicon Valley is actually a valley?!” Should have predicted this one. I kinda knew, but I didn’t know like I do now.
8. “Wow! This shop is openly selling nangs!” (whip its) “And a jungle juice display!”
9. All your cars are so new and shiny. 60% of ours are second hand
10. Most people I see in the streets look below 40. It’s like I’m walking around a university!
11. Wow. It’s really sunny.
12. American accents irl make me feel like I’m walking through a film.
13. “HOLY SHIT! A CYBER TRUCK?!”
14. Ok this is a big one. Apps I’ve had for 8+ years are suddenly different when I arrive here?
15. This is what Uber is meant to be. I will go back to Australia and cry. Your airport has custom instruction… in app! WHAT!? The car arrives in 2 minutes instead of 30 minutes. Also, the car arrives at all.
16. The google app has a beaker for tests now?
17. Snap maps has gifs in it
18. Apple Maps lets you scan buildings? And has tips about good restaurants and events?
19. When I bet in the Manifold app. A real paper Crain flies from the nearest tree, lands in front of me and unfolds. Written inside, “Will Eliezer Yudkowsky open a rationalist bakery?” I circle “Yes”. The paper meticulously folds itself back to a Crain. It looks at me. Makes a little sound that doesn’t echo in the streets but in my head, and it burns. Every time this happens I save the ashes. Are Manifold creating new matter? How are they doing this?
20. That one was a lie

Things that won’t kill me but scare me rational/irrational:

1. What if I’ve been wrong? What if this is all a scam? A cult? What if Mum was right?
2. What if I show up to the location and there is no building there?
3. What if I make some terribly awkward cultural blunder for SF and everyone yells at me?
4. What if no one tells me?
5. I’m sure I’ll be at least in the bottom 5% for intelligence at Less Online. I won’t be surprised or hurt if I’ve got the least Gs of people there. But what if it all goes over my head? Maybe I can’t even communicate with smart people about the things I care about.
6. What if I can’t handle people telling me what they think of my arguments without kid gloves? What if I get angry and haven’t learnt to handle that?
7. I’m just a Drama teacher and Psych student. My head is filled with improv games and fun facts about Clever Hans! ‘Average’ Americans seem to achieve much higher than ‘average’ Australians. I’m scared of feeling under qualified.

Other things:

1. Can you think of something I should be worried about, that I’ve not written here?
2. I’ve brought my copies of the Rationality A-Z books. I want to ask people I meet to sign their favourite post in the two books. Is that culturally acceptable? Feels kinda weird bc Yud is going to be there. But it would be a really warm/fuzzy item to me in the future.
3. I don’t actually know what a lot of the writers going look like. I hope this doesn’t result in a blunder. But might be funny, given that I expect rationalists to be pretty chill.
4. Are other people as excited about the Fooming Shoggoths as I am?
5. I’m 23, I have no idea if that is very old, very young, or about normal for a rationalist. I’d guess about normal, with big spread across the right of a graph.

It feels super weird to be in the same town as a bunch of you guys now. I’ve never met a rationalist irl. I talked to Ruby over zoom once, who said to me “You know you don’t have to stay in Australia right?” I hope Ruby is a good baseline for niceness levels of you all.

If you’re going, I’ll see you at Less.Online. If you’re not, I’d still love to meet you. Feel free to DM me!

Hi! Thank you very much for taking the time to write such a considered response to my ramble of a comment.

Your first question is a hard one to express in text. Instead, I’ll try hard to write a list of requirements for a situation to generate that feeling for me. Then you might be able to image a scenario that meets the requirements and get a similar feeling?

Requirements:

• I must deeply care about the core idea of the subject. For example, I deeply care about animals not coming to harm, or about the world being destroyed by ASI.
• I must disagree with the way it is being protested. For example, the use of loudspeakers, or shouting. Seeming angry gives a sense of irrationality, even if the idea itself is rational.
• I have only seen this in twitter feed context
• I am already scared of the reaction my employer, family, or friends would have if I expressed the idea. For example, I’m afraid when I have to tell a waiter at a restaurant that I’m vegan, because it is a “weird” idea. “Weird” defined above.

What I’ve seen:

• Again, just on twitter
• Extremely small protest groups reminds me of all the antivax or 5G protests I’ve seen irl
• Loudspeakers and yelling
• Leaders on loudspeakers addressing individual open AI employees from outside of gates. In what seems to be a threatening tone. While not necessarily being threatening in context.
• Protestors not taking the inferential distance into account. Which I assume would lead to a confused public. Or individuals presuming the protestors are Luddites.

Thank you again for your reply. I enjoyed having to make this as explicit as possible. Hopefully it helps make the feeling I have clearer.

And thanks you for doing something. I’m not doing anything. I think something is better than nothing.

Are there plans to expand this further if the Beta runs well?

I feel like I’m watching Bluey

IMO I’d feel a lot better if it was less angryish. I think there probably is something like a protest that I can imagine working. I’m not sure if I’d call it a protest? Unless, have you got example protests?

I can image a “change my mind” type of stall/stalls. Where people have calm conversations to explain the situation to the public.

That’s interesting that you don’t consider it a “”weird” thing to protest”.

I guess I want to explicitly point that part out and ask if you stand by the statement? Or maybe I define weird differently? To me weird inside this context means:

“A thing or action that is out of the ordinary in a way that someone encountering it for the first, second, or third time, wouldn’t see as quirky. But as a red flag. If not pre-attached to that thing or person performing the action, a the person seeing it for the first time might form a negative opinion based on the feeling they get seeing it”

I see the Pause AI protests and I cringe. They give me the same feeling I get when I see vegans walk into McDonald’s covered in blood. It feels like: “oh, look. A group that I am a part of is now going to be tied to this small groups actions. That kinda sucks because I wouldn’t do that myself. Totally get their feeling though. Good for them sorta maybe, but also please stop.”

I understand that Scott Alexander talked about PETA and animal ethics a while ago. But I think AI safety has an opportunity right now to take a different approach than PETA had to.

People are already scared. This doesn’t impact “the other” this impacts them. Make that clear. But make it clear is a way that your uncle won’t laugh at over Christmas dinner.

Edit: I just reread this and feel it was a bit harsh on the PAI people. I’m sorry about that. I’d like to point to Chris_Leong’s comment below. It offers something that feels like a better critique than the one I made originally.

I feel like I just walked through a mirror maze and got socked in the nose a couple of times.

In other words, I saw myself, and it hurt.