Vladimir_Nesov comments on Avoiding doomsday: a "proof" of the self-indication assumption - Less Wrong

18 Post author: Stuart_Armstrong 23 September 2009 02:54PM

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Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 23 September 2009 04:31:33PM *  1 point [-]

weighted according to the probability of that observer existing

Existence is relative: there is a fact of the matter (or rather: procedure to find out) about which things exist where relative to me, for example in the same room, or in the same world, but this concept breaks down when you ask about "absolute" existence. Absolute existence is inconsistent, as everything goes. Relative existence of yourself is a trivial question with a trivial answer.

(I just wanted to state it simply, even though this argument is a part of a huge standard narrative. Of course, a global probability distribution can try to represent this relativity in its conditional forms, but it's a rather contrived thing to do.)

Comment author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 23 September 2009 06:20:03PM 1 point [-]

Absolute existence is inconsistent

Wha?

Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 23 September 2009 08:29:15PM *  1 point [-]

In the sense that "every mathematical structure exists", the concept of "existence" is trivial, as from it follows every "structure", which is after a fashion a definition of inconsistency (and so seems to be fair game for informal use of the term). Of course, "existence" often refers to much more meaningful "existence in the same world", with reasonably constrained senses of "world".

Comment author: cousin_it 24 September 2009 08:19:44AM 0 points [-]

"every mathematical structure exists"

How do you know that?

Comment author: loqi 25 September 2009 03:52:33AM 0 points [-]

An ensemble-type definition of existence seems more like an attempt to generalize the term than it does an empirical statement of fact. What would it even mean for a mathematical structure to not exist?