CarlShulman comments on Ben Goertzel: The Singularity Institute's Scary Idea (and Why I Don't Buy It) - Less Wrong
You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.
You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.
Comments (432)
One thing that I think is relevant, in the discussion of existential risk, is Martin Weitzmann's "Dismal Theorem" and Jim Manzi's analysis of it. (Link to the article, link to the paper.)
There, the topic is not unfriendly AI, but climate change. Regardless of what you think of the topic, it has attracted more attention than AGI, and people writing about existential risk are often using climate change as an example.
Martin Weitzman, a Harvard economist, deals with the probability of extreme disasters, and whether it's worth it in cost-benefit terms to deal with them. Our problem, in cases of extreme uncertainty, is that we don't only have probability distributions, we have uncertain probability distributions; it's possible we got the models wrong. Weitzman's paper takes this into account. He creates a family of probability distributions, indexed over a certain parameter, and integrates over it -- and he proves that the process of taking "probability distributions of probability distributions" has the result of making the final distribution fat-tailed. So fat-tailed that the integral doesn't converge.
This is a terrible consequence. Because if the PDF of the cost of the risk doesn't converge, then we cannot define an expected cost. We can't do cost-benefit analysis at all. Weitzman's conclusion is that the right amount to spend mitigating risk is "more than we're doing."
Manzi criticizes this approach as just an elaborately stated version of the precautionary principle. If it's conceivable that your models are wrong and things are even riskier than you imagined, it doesn't follow that you should spend more to mitigate the risk; the reductio is that if you knew nothing at all, you should spend all your money mitigating the most unknown possible risk!
This is relevant to people talking about AGI. We're not considering spending a lot of money to mitigate this particular risk, but we are considering forgoing a lot of money -- the value of a possible useful AI. And it may be tempting to propose a shortcut, a la Marty Weitzman, claiming that the very uncertainty of the risk is an argument for being more aggressive in mitigating it. The problem is that this leads to absurd conclusions. You could think up anything -- murderous aliens! Killer vacuum cleaners! and claim that because we don't know how likely they are, and because the outcome would be world-endingly terrible, we should be spending all our time trying to mitigate the risk!
Uncertainty about an existential risk is not an argument in favor of spending more on it. There are arguments in favor of spending more on an existential risk -- they're the old-fashioned, cost-benefit ones. (For example, I think there's a strong case, in old-fashioned cost-benefit terms, for asteroid collision prevention.) But if you can't justify spending on cost-benefit grounds, you can't try a Hail Mary and say "You should spend even more -- because we could be wrong!"
The talk about uncertainty is indeed a red herring. There are two things going on here:
A linear aggregative (or fast-growing enough in the relevant range) social welfare function makes even small probabilities of existential risk more important than large costs or benefits today. This is the Bostrom astronomical waste point. Weitzmann just uses a peculiar model (with agents with bizarre preferences that assign infinite disutility to death, and a strangely constricted probability distribution over outcomes) to indirectly introduce this. You can reject it with a bounded social welfare function like Manzi or Nordhaus, representing your limited willingness to sacrifice for future generations.
The fact that there are many existential risks competing for our attention, and many routes to affecting existential risk, so that spending effort on any particular risk now means not spending that effort on other existential risks, or keeping it around while new knowledge accumulates, etc. Does the x-risk reduction from climate change mitigation beat the reduction from asteroid defense or lobbying for arms control treaties at the current margin? Weitzmann addresses this by saying that the risk from surprise catastrophic climate change is much higher than other existential risks collectively, which I don't find plausible.