wedrifid comments on Philosophy: A Diseased Discipline - Less Wrong

88 Post author: lukeprog 28 March 2011 07:31PM

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Comment author: chaosmosis 28 October 2012 09:43:17PM *  2 points [-]

Others: downvotes don't fix what problems might be in myron's thoughts. They make them worse.

Myron: preliminary note, your comment sounds a bit presumptuous and demanding.

Substance: I don't believe that rationality necessarily has a fundamental undeniable metaphysical grounding. I believe every philosophy lacks this. Problems like the problem of induction (knowledge comes from experiences and it's impossible to know that the future will be like the past) and the turtles all the way down problem (assumptions are either unwarranted or dependent on further assumptions, which makes all forms of thought either infinitely regressive or groundless) are basically insurmountable. These are problems that all philosophies face and cannot answer satisfactorily.

However, I think you're asking the wrong question. Instead of starting by looking for fundamental metaphysical justifications, which we know to be impossible, we should look to a more pragmatic and tangible level. The brute fact of our existence is that some things work and others don't, that some things seem right and others seem wrong. If someone is insistent upon denying reality, then that's their affair, but they should know that there are consequences to this rejection. I consider the rejection of reality to be viceful, because those who do so reject their own current values and intutions in favor of an embrace of an abstract form of nihilism. Nihilism is much easier than acknowledging reality, but it's also much worse, in my opinion.

Even if nothing that we see or predict or experience or value is real in an absolute and abstract and irrefutable metaphysical sense, it's real and meaningful and useful in the context of our everyday lives. The reality that we face each day is the one that I care about, not the abstract and irrefutable ideological one. That's why I support rationality even if I don't know why rationality works. The fact that it does work, or that it seems to work, is enough for me.

I also think it's relevant that the alternatives to rationality that I've seen have all been worse, in terms of logical metaphysical justification.

Comment author: wedrifid 29 October 2012 01:03:08AM 2 points [-]

Others: downvotes don't fix what problems might be in myron's thoughts. They make them worse.

The expected value of attempting to fix myron's thoughts is not sufficiently high to warrant adopting it as a goal. In fact it is negative. This is due to the low probability of success and the negative externalities the attempt would produce.

Downvotes do help fix the problem of undesirable discussion being visible. In sufficient volume they would also have prevented later parts of this discussion entirely. It would have preempted the frustration that prompted "arrogant arsehole" labels and, indeed, tends to be more effective at making people "fuck off" than actually telling them to. Perhaps some voters simply saw the warning signs ahead of time?

Comment author: chaosmosis 29 October 2012 01:25:13AM *  2 points [-]

At this point I agree, but at that point there was no real sign he'd turn out this way. What warning signs were there? Because if they were there then I missed them and I'd prefer to not miss them in the future.