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tenshiko comments on Rationality Lessons Learned from Irrational Adventures in Romance - Less Wrong
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Comments (609)
I think that the picture detracts from the article. It's a deviation from most other LW pages, heteronormatizes the content, and in addition since the in-picture and out-of-picture background is white, the people look like cutouts in this really awkward way.
Yes. The image also makes the post look like some random "science finds: X!" journalism, and that's not a good thing.
Some of those pages get obscene numbers of page views. Even heavily discounting the "conversion rate" here I think its possible for a net gain, if one objective is to provide novel rational insights to people.
Seems to reflect the content reasonably well actually, since it's a man reflecting on his experience with women...
...true. But as I say here, I'd like to think that Luke intends the material to be more possible to generalize than merely about how men should deal with women, though the concrete examples his personal experience and pursued knowledge provide are relevant to the experience of a man in pursuit of women. In other words, these are "Rationality Lessons Learned from Irrational Adventures in Romance", not "How to Become Vir Sapientior and Get the Girl of Your Dreams".
As Kevin said,
As for the picture heteronormatizing the content... it's an explicitly hetero story, because it's my story. Don't you think it'd be weird to have a homosexual couple in the lead photo for my story?
People indeed like pictures- but stock photos on articles about romance and relationships pattern match to really awful websites.
I presume that tenshiko isn't suggesting a photo of a gay couple. Tenshiko is suggesting no picture. Kevin's point does still seem relevant in that context however.
You predict my opinion correctly - as I've said elsewhere I have other aesthetic concerns due to the picture itself. At the very least I think it'd look much better with a colored background, because of the cutout effect I mention.
I like the photo, but the deviation point is a good one, which you did not address. Was that purposeful?
Yes. I deviate because people like pictures, and LW is not adequately taking advantage of this fact.
Do LW readers like pictures? It seems like the feedback has primarily been negative. Know your audience...
Lukeprog said people like pictures. The feedback has been primarily negative because pictures are not the status quo and people, including LW readers, have a mild preference for cultural norms to be preserved, not challenged.
So you're saying pictures add so little value that "aiee, this is a change" overwhelms it? Can we remove them and be done with it, then?
Crowds typically react negatively to change no matter what postive effects it brings. Wizards of the Coast has a track record of making decisions that were necessary and beneficial to the long term health of their games, each of which brought in new players and which old players eventually adapted to, and every single one of them produced an uproar.
To me, the proper response seems more likely to be using this as an opportunity to adjust our status quo bias downwards.
Yes, but in addition to it being change, it's also genuinely a change I don't like. I've visited enough website to know what I do and don't like. A small topic indicator icon like you see on Slashdot would be fine.
I realize you're getting rather piled on in this thread, so I'm somewhat reluctant to nitpick like this, but:
expresses an idea that is distinct from
It's not all about you, basically.
I like pictures, though not necessarily these particular pictures. Still, I like seeing at a glance a picture that has some connection to the topic of the article.
Not every change is an improvement, but every improvement is a change.
Color me marginalized.
Exactly! Instead of this being a generic discussion of how maybe you can get the romantic utilons you want from more than one person, suddenly it's about the conflict between the educated man's logical evolutionarily dictated interest being directed towards multiple concubines, and the irrational woman's investment in marriage, imposed upon her by society. The shot's composition itself supports this, with the man clearly on top by virtue of more than just being naturally taller.
Is all this Luke's intent? Well, I'd like to think not, especially given his comments about trying to reduce the perception of misogynistic tones in the piece. But as he is a heterosexual man (yes? as far as I've been able to tell Luke's not bisexual or at least didn't present that way during the time period of these stories, please correct me if I'm wrong) Luke's story doesn't deviate from these norms, and the picture is definitely reinforcement.
Would an actual photo of Luke and Alice be better?
Now I'm imagining a picture of Luke with a redacted silhouette of a woman entitled "woman I am not attracted to any more". There are arrows pointing to various lacking physical attributes lacking from an evolutionary psychology perspective, complete with sketches of what they should look like... Perhaps with a supplemental craziness vs hotness chart or two.
Okay, this would actually be really epic and I would support it assuming it didn't have the whole fracking white background creating cutouts thing going on.
I think this could easily lead to an outside observer interpreting this very negatively. I believe the relevant vague catch-all term is "objectifying". The entire approach of a silhouette for the female and an actual picture for the male could easily send very negative signals to a lot of people.
Agreed, but the idea still made me laugh :)