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But could Heinlein "die gallantly"? I think most people tend to leave that one off of their to do lists. I mean if the opportunity arrises, you walk past a burning orphanage for example, why not? But very few people set out to do this one.

randallsquared15y30

Being able to die gallantly doesn't imply that you should or will die gallantly, only that, should the necessity arise...

Unfortunately, Heinlein reportedly refused cryonics (offered without cost to him, if I recall correctly) because he believed it might interfere with reincarnation. From reading the just-out first volume of his biography, it seems quite likely that he was serious.

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19 Burning Man Meetup: Bayes Camp

by Larks

25th Aug 2010

1 min read

19

In celebration of the virtues of applied rationality, Less Wrong is going to Burning Man! And because Heinlein rationalists should win, Bayes Camp is going to be the most awesome place there.

A bunch of people from SingInst/Less Wrong will be descending upon the desert, bedecked as the members of the Bayesian Conspiracy. Kevin, Jasen, JustinShovelain, Peter de Blanc, Michael Vassar and Nick Tarleton, among others, will be there. If you'd like to stop by, say so in the comments!

We'll be at 6:50, F, and should be there from Monday 30th.

Please note: Burning Man is serious stuff, and if you don’t think you’re up to the desert, you shouldn’t come. Either way, read the survival guide.

EDIT: updated location

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[-]Larks15y110

Well, we all survived, and only one injury (a tooth). It was pretty awesome, all told. We trecked through a dust storm with 5ft visibility and ran into another group of Bayesians in the Sandstorm, forming an epic fellowship.

Next year, of course, will be even better. We might even remember to bring cutlery.

[-][anonymous]15y30

Excellent! Where was this other group camped?

For the record, I didn't need to find my fellow conspirators; they found me. I was sitting though some of Future Camp's lectures when I found myself surrounded by hooded figures, familiar symbols drawn on their garbs. They lured me off to their camp, leaving behind JustinShovelain to collect information in my absence. We all played a sleepy game of Nomic in the shade, and meanwhile I may have been an unwitting pawn in a larger, life-or-death game concerning paperclips. It was very pleasant!

[-]Kevin7y20

The idea that Bayes Camp could have been the most awesome thing at Burning Man is funny to me, looking back on this.

[-]mkehrt15y110

Awesome. I'm mostly a lurker, but I'll stop by and meet you people.

[-][anonymous]15y00

With meetup threads the trend tends to be to up vote people for showing enthusiasm, or just for saying they're going. Maybe up voters justify this as way to encourage people to be vocal about participation, but I doubt the up voters are thinking that far ahead. More likely: people excited about a meetup up vote people that seem excited.

[-]mkehrt15y00

It is not at all clear to me why this was upvoted three times.

[-]Jordan15y80

[-]thomblake15y40

Comments informing that someone is going to be attending a meetup fall in the category "I would like to see more comments like this". I just hope it doesn't lead to abuse of strange incentives.

[-]MBlume15y00

Well, now we're just being contrary =P

[-]Document15y00

Could be people using votes as an "I've read this" marker; I've done that sometimes.

[-]Jordan15y00

A marker for their own future reference or for other people's?

[-]Document15y00

I was thinking for their own, but it seems like it would accomplish both.

[-]Pavitra15y80

This is a level of awesomeness I would have expected of the Bardic Conspiracy.

[-]Kevin15y150

Just wait until we put on our Erotic Conspiracy costumes.

[-]gwern15y110

Oh dear. Is there a theorem that members of the Erotic Conspiracy cannot disagree about having sex?

[-]whpearson15y350

They also have arguments over which is more erotic, 50 years of the best sex ever or 3^^^3 accidental nipple brushes.

[-]Pavitra15y30

Just the opposite, I'm afraid. There's a meme to the effect that "your kink is not my kink but your kink is okay" -- an explicit recognition of the need to agree to disagree.

[-]Larks15y10

Only if they have common tastes.

[-]Eliezer Yudkowsky15y20

Now I've written certain unfinished and unpublished stories set in Brennan's world, so I know there's an Erotic Conspiracy and that it's called the Erotic Conspiracy, but may I inquire as to how you know there's such a thing as the Erotic Conspiracy when Google shows that the first reference on LW is in this very thread? Lucky guess, or did the information escape some other way?

[-]LucasSloan15y00

You've talked about it at LW meetups.

[-]Psy-Kosh15y130

Nooooo! You should have said that how you know it is a secret of the Conspiracy Conspiracy! :)

[-]LucasSloan15y60

Shhh! The secrecy of the Pbafcvenpl Pbafcvenpl is tantamount!

[-]Eliezer Yudkowsky15y10

Makes sense. I thought I had a distant memory of that, but wasn't sure of the context.

[-]katydee15y60

Good luck, oh glorious emissaries. We'll want pictures afterwards, of course.

[-]clarissethorn15y50

Sweet. I'll try to remember to stop by.

[-]gwillen15y50

I'll be there! I shall look forward to meeting some of you. :-)

[-]apophenia15y50

I'll be attending as well (A reminder: My real name is Zachary Vance). I will be flying in on the 29th to Reno and leaving the 8th. If anyone wants to meet up for rideshare, I'd be pleased. Post a comment here, or call me: (513) 549-5690.

I hope the costuming is serious. Now I want to wear white noise so people know who I am. P.S. Is there a way to get email notifications for responses to a comment? This would be terribly handy.

Edit: Also, if anyone would care to share a tent, it would be helpful to know today, the 28th. I would save $50 in check-on.

[-]pgaf14y40

yo bayesian

i stopped by the tridome a handful of times throughout the week, and i was curious if i could reconnect with some of the people i met. you may remember me from when we brought bacon. i was the one with the

paul (friend of michael, alexa, and

[-][anonymous]15y40

I will be there! Also, if you want to be part of a village next year, The Playagon would totally welcome Bayes Camp! (We'll have discussions and lectures thanks to Future Camp, and mine, The Time Colony, is a "Resource Center for the Temporally Dislocated". We do a Historical Preenactment. Serious Stuff.) We'll be on Athens between 9:30 and 10.

[-]thomblake15y10

Someone get on that. This is cool enough to get me out there next year.

[-]Mar_1715y30

“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.” ~ Robert Heinlein

Do you think Mr. Heinlein could do all this stuff? I don't think he could. I most certainly can't.

[-]Paul Crowley15y160

It would be astonishing if this list were not pretty much shaped around skills Heinlein happened to have.

[-]Mycroft6553615y10

[-]randallsquared15y30

Being able to die gallantly doesn't imply that you should or will die gallantly, only that, should the necessity arise...

[-]Mitchell_Porter15y110

Do you think Mr. Heinlein could do all this stuff?

Yes I do. He was a naval lieutenant. He and his third wife designed their own house. It's a broad set of skills but not amazingly broad. Anyone who is both book-smart and has spent time in highly physical occupations should have a similar spread.

[-][anonymous]15y70

That quote needs it's punchline! Specialization is for insects.

It's also easy to think that you know how to do all of those things, if you read instruction manuals and never have an opportunity to find out that you're wrong.

Also, I'm working on it. I'll skip on the dying part though.

[-]Pavitra15y20

I was going to mention the heat death of the universe, but surprising breakthroughs do tend to happen, and we have a while to work on it.

[-]ata15y30

That's actually a quote from a character in one of his novels, I think.

[-]Pavitra15y20

I believe it was Lazarus Long.

[-]NancyLebovitz15y120

Actually, there are more layers of deniability than that.

Lazarus Long may have said that, but he may or may not have believed it. He was encouraged to just talk, and he very clearly wasn't putting together a codified system of what he believed. Also, he was known to lie.

And we don't have a full transcript of what he was supposed to have said-- it was a computer-edited compendium of advice, and the computer may have had her own agenda.

Did Heinlein believe everything in the Notebooks of Lazarus Long was good advice? Or was some of it just characterization?

Getting back to the book, LL had longer to acquire skills than ordinary humans.

And, for a counter-argument, see Brin's Glory Season-- one of the reasons women are in charge is that men think they ought to be good at everything and don't get the advantages of specialization.

[-][anonymous]15y00

I think he could. Remember, he was a lieutenant in the navy, and a lifetime is enough to pick up most of those skills (although I suppose it might be hard to prove that you could plan an invasion or die gallantly). Certainly most of the people here could change a diaper, plan a building, write a (bad) sonnet, take & give orders, pitch manure, program a computer, and cook a tasty meal.

[-]Kevin15y30

Additional campers or small groups of campers are welcome to share our space. If today's land grab went as anticipated, we should have a decent chunk of prime space. Try to let us know ahead of time.

[-]Recursionator15y10

My girlfriend and I are looking for a camp, we should get there tomorrow (Thursday). I know it's last minute, so if there isn't any more room we'll just camp at the walk-on site. Current plan is to show up at 6:50 and F and see if there is any room with you guys.

-Jim and Jessica

[-]Kevin15y20

Sorry we missed you, though maybe you stopped by and said hi when I wasn't there. Our camp was kind of hard to find, we were actually at 6:50 and F and a half, F.5, F.G, or whatever you want to call it. Hope you had a great burn.

[-]PhilGoetz15y00

Land grab? I thought the whole area was still off-limits. How does land assignment work?

[-]Kevin15y00

People apply months ahead of time and get assigned space and early access passes. We have some friends that did that and are on the playa already. The unreserved space is first come first serve and they were up there first.

We will now officially be at 6:50 & F.

[-]Jordan15y20

Very cool. If this goes down next year as well I'm totally there.

[-]jimmy15y10

Indeed, very cool. If it happens again, I'll be there too.

[-]Kevin15y20

If this goes well, next year we may organize a more formal theme camp.

[-]AngryParsley15y10

I'll arrive in BRC on Tuesday night. I'm part of camp cryo, which I'm pretty sure will be around 9:30 and E. The camp is about liquid nitrogen ice cream, not cryonics. Look for the reflective geodesic dome with an electroluminescent ice cream cone on top. Most of my burner friends don't know my screenname so ask for Geoff.

[-]adsenanim15y10

http://breadandpuppet.org/

I guess the east-coast version.

Heinlein also had a thing for redheads....

[-]Kevin15y00

On-playa GSM text messaging this year: http://pagalegba2010.wikispaces.com/FAQ

[-][anonymous]15y00

Do you think Mr. Heinlein could do all this stuff? I do think he could. I most certainly can't.

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