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thakil comments on xkcd on the AI box experiment - Less Wrong Discussion

15 Post author: FiftyTwo 21 November 2014 08:26AM

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Comment author: thakil 28 November 2014 08:06:56AM 1 point [-]

Well. While sleight of hand is a key tool in magic, traditionally confederates and even camera tricks have been too. David Blaine's famous levitation trick, for instance, looks so impressive on TV because they cheated and made it look more impressive than it is.

Mentalism as a magic power is not a real thing, sorry. It is a title magician's sometimes took and take to make their act look different. http://simonsingh.net/media/articles/maths-and-science/spectacular-psychology-or-silly-psycho-babble/ Simon Singh on some of the tricks. http://www.secrets-explained.com/derren-brown has a list of some of the tricks he performs as well.

Comment author: ciphergoth 28 November 2014 10:36:47AM 2 points [-]

At least some of these "explanations" are exactly like the explanations Brown himself proffers, eg http://www.secrets-explained.com/derren-brown/card-suggestion

Comment author: thakil 28 November 2014 11:23:01AM 1 point [-]

Well, that's what I get for finding a source without checking it properly I suppose.

Comment author: Salemicus 28 November 2014 10:07:40AM 2 points [-]

Of course mentalism isn't a "magic power." Derren Brown is a stage magician, not a mystical sorceror! But he does use "mentalism" skills, especially cold reading. A lot of that is traditional magic too.

Simon Singh's article is silly. Of course it's misdirection when a magician tells you how he's about to perform his trick. Of course Derren Brown implies his tricks are more real, more impressive and more noteworthy than they really are. Of course you can't really psychologically manipulate people in the way Derren Brown claims to, any more than David Copperfield really can make the statue of Liberty disappear. That's precisely why it's an entertaining show - no-one would be impressed by a magician whose "tricks" were mundane things that people really could do.

Derren Brown says he uses a mixture of "magic, suggestion, psychology, misdirection and showmanship". He never claims to have genuine magic powers.

Comment author: thakil 28 November 2014 10:31:25AM 1 point [-]

Indeed, but if Derren Brown guesses your mobile number, it's probably a "trick" rather than "mentalism". ThisSpaceAvailable has claimed that he can manipulate people. I would argue that this is weakly true, and he uses it for the simpler tricks he performs, but for the really impressive effects he probably falls on traditional magic tricks most of the time. The card trick by Simon Singh demonstrates that: he hasn't used mind manipulation to pick the cards, he's used a standard card trick and dressed it with the language of "mentalism".

Note that I make no claim that there is anything wrong with all this! But Derren Brown is trying to fool you, and that is to be remembered. He also does a similar thing to Penn and Teller, where he shows you how some of the trick is done but leaves the most "amazing" part hidden (I'm thinking of the horse racing episode, which was great, and the chess playing trick)