All of Matt Vincent's Comments + Replies

[...]spontaneous large protests tends to be in response to triggering events[...]

Unless you have a very optimistic view of warning shots, we shouldn't rely on such an opportunity.

typically don't interact non-trivially

Or, as Orwell would prefer, "typically interact trivially".

I would have liked to see those who disagree with this comment engage with it more substantially. One reason I think that we're likely to have a warning shot is that LLM-based AIs are pretty consistently overconfident. Also, AI Control schemas have a probabalistic chance of catching misaligned AIs.

I know this is an old comment, but it's expressing a popular sentiment under a popular post, so I'm replying mainly for others' sake.

There's an organization called PauseAI that lobbies for an international treaty against building powerful AI systems. It's an international organization, but the U.S. branches in particular could use a lot of help.

I've never worked in HR, and I don't think that any of my friends have, either, so I know very little about the field. What are the channels of feedback that you (or HR professionals more generally) use to evaluate hiring decisions after the fact?

I think this post suffers from a lack of rigor regarding the limits of the advice. One limit is that, if you let your vibes steer you away from interpersonal interactions, then you'll eliminate interactions that have higher-than-average upside potential.

In most cases, most people's perceptions are similar to yours. (e.g. If you think that the guy who asked you out is weird, then most of the other women who he asked out probably think so, too.) Consequently, if you and everyone else in the same situation are steered by vibes, then your failures of judgement... (read more)

I took another look at my source, and I think you're right. The subject of the plot, the Federal Register (FR), lists changes to the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR). It also suffers from the other problem that I identified (repeals counting as new rules).

For anyone who's curious, here's a nice overview of measures of regulatory burden.

This post isn't without value, but I am put-off by its use of A) working papers instead of published research, and B) the use of an LLM for doing research.

In terms of Zvi's 4 levels of legality, I think that your reasoning is a valid argument against crossing the line between 2 and 3. However, I don't think that it's a valid argument against what Zvi is actually proposing, which is going from 1 to 2. If we have an obligation to help people who have APD, then the most cost-effective/highest-utility solution might involve making gambling less convenient for the general population.

I agree with the spirit of your comment, but there are a couple of technical problems with it. For one thing, the total number of pages does sometimes decrease. (See the last plot in this document.) Total pages isn't a perfect measure of regulatory burden, but many other measures have the problem of counting repeals as new regulations. (See the same source for a discussion about what counts as a "rule".) Also, most regulations are drafted by executive agencies, not legislatures--especially at the federal level.

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6MondSemmel
I appreciate the link and the caveats! Re: "the total number of pages does sometimes decrease", it's not clear to me that that's the case. These plots show "number of pages published annually", after all. And even if that number is an imperfect proxy for the regulatory burden of that year, what we actually care about is in any case not the regulatory burden of a year, but the cumulative regulatory burden. That cannot possibly have stayed flat for 2000~2012, right? So that can't be what the final plot in the pdf is saying.

What exactly is your hypothesis? Is it something like: P1) People are irrationally averse to actions that have a positive expected value and a low probability of success. P2) Self-deception enables people to ignore the low probability of success. C) Self-deception is adaptive.

I tried to test this reasoning by referencing the research that Daniel Kahneman (co-coiner of the term "planning fallacy") has done about optimism. He has many criticisms of over-optimism among managers/executives, as well as more ordinary people (e.g. those who pursue self-employment... (read more)

I think that kind of person is included in group 1:

"People who are adversarial or untrustworthy [...] as representatives of the system on behalf of which they act".

This question might be independent from my other one, so I'm putting it in a separate comment.

What's your primary solution to the problems that you list? Do you think that it can be mostly solved by teachers--e.g. by not exaggerating the applicability of the course material--or do you think that it requires a systemic solution--e.g. by sending the disruptive and inattentive kids to a class (potentially a quite unconventional one) that they're more interested in?

I ask because I'm considering changing careers to become a high school math teacher, and I'd lik... (read more)

2Valentine
You ask a good question. I have a lot of thoughts about it. Different answers at different levels. Like, what should a civilization do vs. what should a parent do vs. what should a teacher do? Different answers. The overall theme, though, is to remove coercion and appeal to native fascination instead. If you have something of value to the student to offer, then in practice there's a way to either (a) show the student that value or (b) earn the student's trust that you're tracking what they care about such that when you say "Trust me" they know there's something good there even if they can't see it for themselves just yet. If you're aiming to be a teacher… well, it's tricky because last I checked, the systems you're embedded in impose mandatory coercion. You have to cover certain topics, often in a certain order, within a certain window of time, etc. Especially since "No Child Left Behind" tied funding to test scores. And parents get mad and start rattling sabres if their kids come back from math class with a bunch of weird stuff the parents don't recognize. Although maybe that was just the Boomers. But that said! There are clever ways of working within these social constraints. If you can do that, the overall thrust for a teacher is to prioritize being curious about how the students are thinking rather than on getting them to understand certain concepts. The lion's share of work for a really good math teacher is in identifying zinger questions. You have to see how a student is thinking about a problem, and follow their contours of reasoning, and notice where it's going to run them into trouble. You could just tell them about the trouble, but it's far more effective to ask them to explain something or figure out something that will lead them right to the paradox spot. After a while you'll probably develop a really rich repertoire of such questions. And maybe more preciously, you'll be familiar with a vast library of thinking styles that students actually use in

Would you say the same of most other class subjects? I ask because, with the exceptions of reading and persuasive writing, I don't think that any conventional school subject is more applicable to the average person's life than grade-school math.

Yes, people can get through life with an astonishing ignorance of mathematics, but they can get through life with an even more astonishing ignorance of social studies, literature, and the sciences.

In my opinion, the purpose of public basic education is twofold:

  1. Identify the children who are talented at a given subj
... (read more)
2Valentine
I was homeschooled and then studied math education, so I'm not sure. But my passing impression is (a) yes, it applies to most methods of teaching in schools regardless of subject; but (b) math taught this way is particularly damaging. I want to emphasize that this is my impression. I'm also not entirely sure why math seems to be more damaging. I have guesses. I just observe that e.g. literature hatred or music phobia aren't nearly as prevalent as math trauma is. Best as I can tell.   Well, sure. But people will also pick up the math they need as they need it for the most part. That's true of most subjects really. I didn't learn to read in school. I went to kindergarten before being homeschooled, and they were teaching us the alphabet and some basic words, but I could already read books by then. I learned to read because I wanted to read. There's something very weird in our cultural groundwater around what teaching is. It's like we start with a prescription of subjects and then default to coercion to get students to "know" those subjects. Why? If it's relevant to their lives, we could learn to point out the connection in a way that feels alive to them. If we can't do that, then what makes us so sure that it's relevant for them?   Yeah I do. I think the most imporant function of widespread education is to make good citizens. Which is to say, children put through an education system need to come out of it better able to engage with the system that runs their civilization, including the education process for the next generation. In the United States, I think that puts civics as the most important subject. It's really key that citizens understand how their government works, what the checks and balances are, how jury nullification works, what forms of corruption actually do arise even within the current system, etc. Otherwise they don't know how to participate in the government that's supposedly "by the people, for the people". This is vastly more important than l

I think that I have a personal example of this advice in action. I often find it helpful to use my driving speed and the distance to the next turn to estimate how soon I'll need to turn. That indicates how desperately I need to change lanes, whether it's a good time to initiate a conversation, etc.

Is the main point of this post that people should play around more with numbers and estimation? If so, then I agree with it, but there are two aspects of the post that I found distracting.

One was the overly broad use of the word "arithmetic". Arithmetic and algebra have substantially different histories, and they occupy somewhat different roles in contemporary society. (Especially for young math students.) Consequently, I think it's best to avoid using the words interchangeably.

The other is the repeated emphasis of dimensional analysis. Although it was pro... (read more)

Does anyone here have qualms about the moral status of the embryos that are discarded in this process? I'm aware of the OP's views on the issue, and I recently addressed them elsewhere, but I'm curious about the average viewer of this page.

-5Jakub Supeł
7Seth Herd
Emphatically no. They are primarily potential lives, but they need their mother's womb to achieve that potential, and they can't all have that. Those simple brains have no more inherent moral worth than an insect with a similar number of neurons. Only one life can come out of this process. Whether that one is chosen by chance or choice, the one resulting life has the same moral worth.

Thanks for the response. I realize that this is a very belated reply, and that it would have done a lot more good prior to the release of your How-To-PSC essay. Nevertheless, I'll respond to a few of your points.

For one thing, an embryo that was conceived from the gametes of two humans doesn't "grow into a human" or "develop into a human"; it is a human. I'm not saying that this necessarily confers moral worth, but it does jog the question of which trait does, and you don't provide a strong alternative.

In defense of the ZEF's potentiality: before fertiliza... (read more)

2GeneSmith
Interesting viewpoint. I think your point about the morality of having children despite the high natural miscarriage rate is a good one. My basic view is that human moral value develops throughout pregnancy (and indeed continues to develop after birth). I don't think there's a simple binary switch from "no value" to "value". I'd treat it more like a gradual ramp-up beginning with brain development during pregnancy. I'm curious how you feel about culturing of naive embryonic stem cells. It's possible to culture cells from a very early embryo and maintain their epigenomic state. One might then perform some editing on each, then grow each into a colony of perhaps 100 cells before destructively sequencing some of the stem cells and then performing subsequent edits on the stem cells in which the edits successfully took place. If done correctly, the process would result in an embryo with much better prospects for a healthy and happy life. One embryo goes in and one embryo goes out. But the sequencing in the interim steps would require the destruction of naive embryonic stem cells. Would you consider such a process morally permissible?

I find this post very encouraging, but I can't shake a particular concern about the approach that it recommends.

From extrapolating past experiences, it seems like every time I try (or even succeed) at something ambitious, I soon find that somebody else already did that thing, or proved why that thing can't work, and they did it better than I would have unless I put in ten times as much effort as I did. In other words, I struggle to know what's already been done.

I notice that this happens a lot less often with mathematics than it used to. Perhaps part of it... (read more)

I would be completely on-board with this if there was a method of improvement other than IVF embryo selection, since I consider human embryos to have moral value. Even if you don't, unless you're very sure of your position, I'd ask you to reconsider on the basis of the precautionary principle alone--i.e. if you're wrong, then you'd be creating a huge problem.

2GeneSmith
I’d give us 50% odds of developing the technology capable of human genetic enhancement without excess embryos in the next decade. Editing looks like the most plausible candidate, though chromosome selection also looks pretty feasible. I’ve given a lot of thought to the question of whether discarding embryos is acceptable. Maybe I’ll write a post about this at some point, but I’ll try to give a quick summary: * At the time of selection, human embryos have about 100 cells. They have no brain, no heart, and no organs. They don’t even have a nervous system. If they stopped development and never grew into humans, we would give them zero moral weight. Unless you believe that the soul enters the embryo during fertilization, the moral importance of an embryo is entirely down to its potential to develop into a human. * The potential of any given pairing of egg and sperm is almost unchanged after fertilization. A given pairing of sperm and egg will produce the same genome every time. I don’t see a clear line at fertilization regarding the potential of a particular sperm/egg coupling. * Roughly a third of regular non-IVF pregnancies end in miscarriage; usually before the mother even knows she’s pregnant. The rate of miscarriage approaches 100% towards a woman’s late 40s. If embryos are morally equivalent to babies, there is a huge ongoing preventable moral disaster going on during normal conception, to the point where one could make a case that unprotected sex between 40 and menopause is immoral.

I'm sorry if I'm just being too much of a dodo to perceive the mystery, but your scenario seems easily accounted for. You can use a Bayesian network to infer causality if and only if you have valid data to fill it with. Of course wearing large pants does not cause one not to exercise, but no real set of data would indicate that it did. Am I missing something?

EDIT: shortly after writing this, I read up on faithfulness and Milton Friedman's thermostat, so the "if and only if" part of my comment isn't quite accurate. Still, the pants size scenario doesn't seem like one of these exceptional cases.

Statements of the sort "we shouldn't balance the risks and opportunities of X" are substantive only where X is closely related to a fundamental principle or a terminal goal. Since nobody really wants superhuman AGI for its own sake (in fact, it's just the opposite: it's the ultimate instrumental goal), "we should balance the risks and opportunities of AGI" is an applause light.

Agreed. Zvi's proposition also simply doesn't align with first-world people's motivations, as far as I can tell. In short, first-worlders have a lot of other interesting ways that they can use their time.

The notion that money isn't important or that "knowledge is the real wealth" wasn't intended to be a universal law; it's only applicable in cases where money is sufficiently abundant (as the title says). The scenarios you list do not meet that condition, so they are not situations that the OP intended to address.

With an additional decade of political battles to scrutinize, I see this sort of thing playing out with things like immigration policy, and possibly COVID policy, too.

From what I can gather, there are plenty of Republicans who would be willing to make a one-time amnesty concession in exchange for securing the border. However, Republican politicians are aware that if they give any ground on amnesty in this particular case, then Democratic politicians are very likely to 1) drag their feet on the securing-the-border part of the deal, and then 2) cite the previous amnesty policy as precedent for future amnesty policies in the court of public opinion.

Doesn't this depend on whether one is referring to fluid intelligence or crystal intelligence? Human babies may have the same crystal intelligence as adult pigs, but they have much higher fluid intelligence.

I think what happened here is that the vegetarian failed to realize that the component of intelligence that people find morally significant is fluid, not crystal, and then he equivocated between the two. EY realized what was going on, even if subconsciously, which is why he trolled the vegetarian instead of disputing his premise. Finally, Fallible failed to pick up on the distinction entirely by assuming that "intelligence" always refers to fluid intelligence.

It's useful until the jester gains a reputation as someone whose views shouldn't be taken seriously, at which point the jester's dissent may begin to have the opposite effect.

1Martin Randall
This can be countered, the emperor can occasionally take the jester's side, and the jester can hide serious views behind a mask of silliness.