ZZZling
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"So if you're under the impression that this is a point..."
Yes, I'm under that impression. Because the whole idea about "Friendly AI" implies a subtle, indirect, but still control. The idea here is not to control AI at its final stage, rather to control what this final stage is going to be. But I don't think such indirect control is possible. Because in my view, the final shape of AI is invariant of any contingencies, including our attempts to make it "friendly" (or "non-friendly"). However, I can admit that on early stages of AI evolution such control may be possible, and even necessary. Therefore, researching "Friendly AI" topic is NOT a waste... (read more)
Yes, there is some ambiguity in use of words, I myself noticed it yesterday. I can only say that you understood it correctly and made the right move! OK, I'll try to be more accurate in using words (sometimes it is not simple, requires time and effort).
Thanks for short and clear explanation. Yes, I understand these ideas, even the last point. But with all due respect to Eliezer and others, I don't think there is a way for us to control a superior being. Some control may work at early stages when AI is not truly intelligent yet, but the idea of fully grown AI implies, by definition, that there is no control over it. Just think about it. This also sounds as a tautology. Of course we can try to always keep AI in an underdeveloped state, so that we can control it, but practically that is not possible. Somebody, somewhere, due to yet another crisis, ..., etc, will let it go. It will grow according to some natural informational laws that we don't know yet and will develop some natural values independent not only of our wishes, but any other contingencies. That's how I see it. Now you can vote me down.
Well, it's not that I made it to self-organize, it is information coming from the real world that did the trick. I only used a conventional programming language to implement a mechanism for such self-organization (neural network). But I'm not programming the way how this network is going to function. It is rather "programmed" by reality itself. The reality can be considered as a giant supercomputer constantly generating consistent streams of information. Some of that information is fed to a network and makes it to self-organize.
You've implemented a neural network (rather simple) and made it to self-organize to recognize rabbits. It was self-organized following outside sensory input (this is only one way direction of information flow, another direction would be sending controlling impulses to network output, so that those impulses would affect what kind of input the network receives).
I think I understand now why you keep mentioning GAP. You thought that I objected the idea of morality programming due to zombie argument. Sort of, we will create only a morality imitating zombie, rather than a real moral mind, etc. No, my objection is not about this. I dont take zombies seriously and dont care about them. My objection is about hierarchy violation. Programming languages are not right means to describe/implement high-level cognitive architectures, which will be a basis for morality and other high-level phenomena of mind.
I thought those question were innocent. But if it looks like a violation of some policy, then I apologize for that. I never meant any personal attack. I think you understand my point now (at least partially) and can see how weird it looks to me such ideas as programming morality. I now realize, there maybe many people here who take these ideas seriously.
I think you misunderstood my point here.
But first, yes, I skimmed through the recommended article, but dont see how does it fit in here. Its an old familiar dispute about philosophical zombies. My take on this, the idea of such zombies is rather artificial. I think it is advocated by people who have problems a understanding mind/body connection. These people are dualists, even if they don`t admit it.
Now about morality. There is a good expression in the article you referenced: high-level cognitive architectures. We don`t know yet what this architecture is, but this is the level that provides categories and the language one has to understand and adopt in order to understand... (read more)
Im not against other people having different points of view on AI. Everybody is entitle to his/her own opinions. However, in recommended references I dont find answers to my questions. You can vote ME down, without even trying to provide logical argument, but those question and alternative ideas about AI will not go away. Some other people will ask similar questions on different forums, or put forward similar ideas. And only future will tell who is actually right!
Jeff's and his acquaintance's ideas should be combined! Why one or the other? Let's implement both! Ok, plan is like this. Offer all people "happiness maximization" free option, first. Those who accept it will immediately go to Happiness Vats. I hope, Jeff Kaufman, as the author of the idea, will go first, giving all us a positive example. When a deadline for "happiness maximization" program is over, then "suffering minimization" starts and the rest of humanity is wiped out by a sudden all out nuclear attack. Given that lucky vat inhabitants don`t care about real world any more, the second task becomes relatively simple, just annihilate everything on earth, burn it to... (read more)