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All of tpebop's Comments + Replies

I don't understand. Are you saying that if an exactly replica of my brain was created, then it wouldn't be me? If that's the case, then why sign up for cryonics?

6JGWeissman15y

No, I am saying the opposite, that the exact replica of your brain would be you, complete with your consiousness.

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y10

I personally just think that everyone should be given the same chance to live a long and happy life. I don't think anyone should be "privileged" enough to live longer than anyone else, simply because they have the financial means to do so.

I do think societies are optimized for their average inhabitant lifespan. If a group of "super humans" came about, I think that they'd be met with extreme opposition from other "normal" people. If you've ever read a history boook, or watched the news, then you're already aware of the numerous... (read more)

7CronoDAS15y

Should we give up antibiotics because some people can't afford them?

0Alicorn15y

Well, if you were the freakishly immortal male, nobody would (probably) be able to tell until you were the far side of thirty; so while it might or might not help, it doesn't seem like it'd hurt, in the finding-mates department.

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y00

If I am lucky enough to be eternally financially secure and healthy, then I'd like to live to the life expectancy of everyone else. this is taking into account cryonics. If it becomes ubiquitous to live very long, via any means, then I'd like to live just as long. If in 2010, the average adult male lived to be 30 years old, I wouldn't want to live to be 200.

6Alicorn15y

This is really interesting. Do you have a dispreference for uniqueness in other things, too? Do you think that societies are optimized for the average lifespans of their inhabitants and wouldn't be able to deal with a longer-lived outlying specimen? You specified "male" - if males lived 30 years and females got to be a thousand, would you still want to live to be only 30?

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y00

I phrased my original statement from the point of view of a person who lives in a world where people live to be 80. I'd like to live as long as everyone else lives, if cryonics, prosthesis, nanotechnology, or some unforeseen technology come across that allows people to live to be thousands of years old, then I'd like to live as long as them too. I'm afraid of being alone, and I wouldn't like to be the last person, or one of the last people alive.

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y00

My opinion has changed. I'd like to live as long as everyone else. No more, no less. If the average life expectancy of a healthy American male was 1,000 years, then I'd like to live to be the ripe old age of 1,000. I would not like to rely on cryonics to extend my life. I would however use cloned organs, full body prosthesis, or nanotechnology to extend my life.

My biggest concern with cryonics is whether my consciousness could be transferred to a new body. I'm still skeptical about how consciousness is formed exactly. I'm skeptical that if an exact (to th... (read more)

5JGWeissman15y

It sounds like you are worried about philosophical zombies. The key point of the linked article is that an atom for atom replica of your brain would direct its body to talk about its consious experiences for the same reason you talk about your consious experiences, so it would be an astounding coincidence if your reports of consiousness corresponded with your experience if that consious experience was not part of the causal physics governing the atoms.

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y10

I guess it depends on how well I'm able to sustain my own existence. If at age 120(150~200) I'm unable to feed, or financially support myself. Then yes, I'd like to die. If I'm at the high point of my life, successful(this is relative, assume my evaluation of success is the same as yours), healthy, and have enough activities to keep me entertained, then I'd like to continue living.

3Paul Crowley15y

So at what point would you like to die no matter how well you're doing?

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y00

edit: I'd like to live to maybe 150~200. I don't find that impossible with current medical/technological advances. The leading causes of death in old age tend to be as a result of organ failure and disease. I imagine that in the near future if any of my organs fail, I'll be able to have them replaced via prosthesis, or cloned organs.

5Paul Crowley15y

And once 120, you'd like to die, even if you find you're in better health at 120 than you are now?

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y00

I do not believe I'll be singing up for cryonics. Not because I think it's too expensive, or impossible to be reanimated. The reason I won't be signing up is because I have no interest in living forever.

6Paul Crowley15y

Can you be more precise about the age at which you wish to die?

2AngryParsley15y

OK, but do you have an interest in living for say... 100 years ? 200 years? 1,000,000 years? All of these lifespans are significantly shorter than forever, yet longer than current lifespans.

4Blueberry15y

Well, even if you were preserved, you still wouldn't live "forever". You could still die in an accident in some way that wouldn't allow you to be dethawed. You could still die from an illness that hasn't been cured yet. And you wouldn't survive the heat death of the universe. But, why wouldn't you want to keep living? I hear this sentiment often and really don't understand it. I've always wanted to be immortal.

Normal Cryonics

tpebop15y200

I'm only posting this to play devils advocate, if not to stir up the debate a bit. I apologize for any spelling or grammatical errors. English isn't my first language.

To make groupthink testable, Irving Janis devised eight symptoms indicative of groupthink (1977).

(My interpretations may be flawed, feel free to point out any flaws in my logic)

> 1. Illusions of invulnerability creating excessive optimism and encouraging risk taking. Cryonics = eternal life in the future, relatively high financial risk, relatively low risk of being revived. The risk ... (read more)

0Dan_Moore15y

Re: Groupthink symptom #1 - illusions of invulnerability or infallibility The fact that the subject matter of cryonics is about an extended lifespan or second lifespan does not automatically confer this symptom of groupthink. An example of groupthink often given is the decision process of the Bush Administration which led to the invasion of Iraq in 2003. Much of the information used to come to that decision was 'slam dunk' pre-invasion, but ultimately spurious or unverifiable.

4Jack15y

Actually, devil's advocacy is probably the best way to prevent group think (outside of earnest dissent). So well done. It also occurs to me that some people holding a belief as a result of group think is entirely consistent with the belief being true and even justified-- which is an interesting feature that isn't always be obvious. I think I represent a partial data point against group think in this case because I have a something of a revulsion against the aesthetics of cryonics, some of the social implications and some of the arrogance I see in it's promotion but nonetheless conclude that it is probably a worthwhile gamble.