Vladimir_Nesov comments on Open Thread: February 2010 - Less Wrong

1 Post author: wedrifid 01 February 2010 06:09AM

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Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 23 March 2010 10:02:41AM 0 points [-]

If a glass falls on the ground and shatters, is it "discovering implications of information", etc?

Sure.

If the answer is yes, does that mean it feels like something for the glass to shatter?

No.

Comment author: Mitchell_Porter 23 March 2010 11:07:56PM 1 point [-]

If the answer is yes, does that mean it feels like something for the glass to shatter?

No.

Why not?

Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 24 March 2010 02:29:26AM 0 points [-]

Because a glass has no mind, naturally.

Comment author: Mitchell_Porter 24 March 2010 02:47:14AM 1 point [-]

Can you justify that in a noncircular way? What's a mind, and why doesn't a glass have one?

Comment author: Jack 24 March 2010 03:43:38AM 3 points [-]

Is someone really obligated to define "mind" just in order to demonstrate that a glass is not in the set of things that has one? I can't define "game" but "the weak nuclear force" is not an example of one.

Comment author: Mitchell_Porter 24 March 2010 04:01:11AM 1 point [-]

If I read him correctly, Vladimir is proposing to make time itself a mind-dependent phenomenon. Time happens inside minds but not inside shattering glasses. So he needs to explain the difference.

Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 24 March 2010 08:54:20AM *  1 point [-]

Time happens inside minds but not inside shattering glasses

Time does happen inside shattering glasses, and it's not "mind-dependent". Happy?

Comment author: Mitchell_Porter 24 March 2010 10:37:46AM 2 points [-]

But you said:

time itself is arguably how discovering implications of information that is already here feels from the inside

Time itself is how a certain process feels from the inside. If time is a feeling, it can only happen where there are feelings, so if it happens inside shattering glasses, then they have feelings.

Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 24 March 2010 03:24:21PM 0 points [-]

That was a reference to "how an algorithm feels from the inside", with "feels" not intended for literal interpretation.

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